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Carter says Florida Voting Still Not Fair 191

linuxwrangler writes "Ex president Jimmy Carter is claiming that Florida has still not created conditions for a fair election. The Carter Center has monitored over 50 elections worldwide for fairness and says that the absence of uniformity in voting procedures and the lack of a non-partisan election commission sets the stage for a repeat of the 2000 election. That election, overseen by Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris (aka co-chair of the Bush-Cheney state campaign committee), was officially decided by a margin of 537 votes. According to Carter, Florida governor Jeb Bush (aka brother of George W. Bush) has done little to correct the problems found in the 2000 election. In addition, Harris' successor Glenda Hood, (aka an elector for George W. Bush in 2000) recently attempted to disqualify 22,000 African Americans (likely Democrats), but only 61 Hispanics (likely Republicans), as alleged felons."
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Carter says Florida Voting Still Not Fair

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  • Of course! (Score:2, Insightful)

    by cheezedawg ( 413482 )
    How could we ever think there can be a fair election if Nader is on the ballot!

    • Could you please rename this section to

      • From Carter's Op-Ed:
        The top election official has also played a leading role in qualifying Ralph Nader as a candidate, knowing that two-thirds of his votes in the previous election came at the expense of Al Gore.

        So that is one of his complaints- that Nader is on the ballot. I was not trying to flamebait. That comes directly from Carter.
        • No, you oversimplified the insight of President Carter: the Florida election is being rigged by the Republicans including techniques like getting Nader on the ballot, despite his lack of qualification, because they know that Nader will draw votes away from Kerry, contributing to a Bush victory. The Republicans are gaming the system, and Carter is telling us how. You are denying it.
          • The Florida elections are being run mostly by Democrats (as they were in 2000), and the current Chief Justice who ruled in Nader's favor was also one of the strongest advocates for the Gore recount four years ago.

            You can put your tin-foil hat back into storage.

            Oh, and speaking of Carter, can anybody name an election or two which he oversaw for the UN that ended up being fair and democratic? He seems to be very good at helping thrid-world despots win elections. I wish he would go back to building houses
            • What are you talking about, Democrats running the Florida elections? The Florida Secretary of State runs their elections, and she was an actual elector for Bush in 2000. The governor, who sets all the policies and manages all the people, is still Bush's brother. The attempt to keep Nader off the ballot, since he's only a spoiler and not actually representing the nonexistent "Reform" party, was foiled by Governor Bush, despite a court ruling overriding Bush's placement of the spoiler on the ballot. Where ar
  • by Marxist Hacker 42 ( 638312 ) * <> on Monday September 27, 2004 @05:18PM (#10366653) Homepage Journal
    Where it is forbidden (by State Law!) for elections officials to ask about the *citizenship of the voters* beyond the standard form. Residency questions are OK, citizenship questions are not.
  • At least there he is wanted. I, for one, already voted (got my Absentee ballot Friday) and while Nader was on the ballot, he didn't get my vote.
  • by WhatAmIDoingHere ( 742870 ) <> on Monday September 27, 2004 @05:39PM (#10366875) Homepage
    Should the people who help run an election campaign also be in charge of vote counting or collection?

    Isn't there some conflict of interest there?
  • what about this? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by DAldredge ( 2353 ) <SlashdotEmail@GMail.Com> on Monday September 27, 2004 @05:39PM (#10366880) Journal
    Posted on 08/25/2004 6:20:16 AM PDT by moonman

    ABC News (radio) announced that over 46,000 New York City residents were registered to vote in both their home district and also in the state of Florida. The anouncement mentioned that two-thirds (2/3) are registered Democrats.

    NEW YORK, (UPI) -- Allegations first made by the New York Daily News that residents of New York state may have voted illegally in Florida elections has produced calls for a formal investigation by Florida officials.

    A study of computer records in New York and Florida conducted by the Daily News found 46,000 New York residents illegally registered to vote in both states.

    The paper's investigation also uncovered the fact that as few as 400 and as many as 1,000 of those illegally registered voted twice in at least one election.

    In some cases, people were found to have violated the law by voting twice in as many as seven elections.

    "We expect that people will follow the law," said Florida Department of State spokeswoman Alia Faraj. "If there is an indication that people haven't, then the appropriate agencies must look into this matter." -30-


    • Honestly, if you have a home there or live there for some part of the year, you should be allowed to vote in the elections there.

      My reasoning is that you do pay taxes there, and the representative's decisions there will effect your life.

      If you get the opportunity to vote twice in an election, so be it. Each state conducts their own voting and has their own policies for the federal elections. Essentially it is like 50 smaller elections, but they get tallied to one big election in the end. So, congra

      • I understand your reasoning, but I think it's a bit flawed. If someone owns property in 50 states should that person have 49 votes over their neighbor? You could extend that logic further. Should someone who has 1000 times more property than the next person be allowed to have 1000 more votes?

        The obvious answer (I hope!) is "no" since it gives an unfair advantage to the rich over the poor.
    • Yeah, I've seen this story and am not too impressed. So as many as 1000 people voted twice. Although they break down how many Democrats are registered in both states, they don't mention how many Democrats voted twice. Obviously it's impossible to tell, but even if we assume the ratio is the same we're talking about 600 voters. That pails in comparison to the systemic violation of voters' rights (mostly minorities) in the 2000 election.
  • Carter? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by medcalf ( 68293 ) on Monday September 27, 2004 @05:58PM (#10367090) Homepage
    Let's see, after his interesting call on the Venezuelan elections (it is legit, said Carter before all of the votes were even certified, and well before all of the interesting information about electronic voting machines programmed by a company owned by Chavez's brother were out in the open), he now wants to call the Florida elections before they happen?

    Not a word about the estimated 15000-20000 voters in the FL panhandle (generally a Republican area) who didn't vote after the networks called the election for Gore before the polls closed in the panhandle.

    Not a word about the 4.4% error rate (mostly overvotes) in Palm Beach County (controlled by Democrat election officials) vice the 0.4% statewide error rate. Or about the interesting fact that Bush got fewer votes in Palm Beach County than all four Republican congressional candidates combined.

    No word about the tens of thousands of New Yorkers (generally Democrat-leaning) also registered in Florida.

    Not a word about motor voter issues, or the illegality of even asking for an ID at the polling place in most states.

    Not a word about electronic voting machines that don't produce a paper record. Not a word about problems with absentee ballot fraud. Not a word about the interesting character of elections in Chicago.

    I think that there are problems with the integrity of votes in the US. But I only see the Democrats getting exercised about it when the issue might play against them. Then, they are vitriolic. But never when the problems help them.

    There is room for a dispassionate look at the issue. This is just partisan grandstanding.
    • Let's see, after his interesting call on the Venezuelan elections (it is legit, said Carter before all of the votes were even certified, and well before all of the interesting information about electronic voting machines programmed by a company owned by Chavez's brother were out in the open), he now wants to call the Florida elections before they happen?

      If I were to focus on this paragraph, I'm sure I'd be modded "offtopic". Aw, what the heck:

      I wouldn't be surprised if Chavez hired some monkeys [] to play
      • I'm hardly a Venezuela expert, so I'll be more general than maybe you're hoping for. The coup was, as far as I can tell, really badly done. For one thing, the plotters had not bothered to make a case before ousting Chavez. For another thing, they didn't kill him (understandable, but unfortunate for them, since many of them are now quite dead; Chavez didn't see things quite their way). In the end, the biggest problem was that the landed interests and businessmen simply didn't like Chavez, but at the time

    • <disclaimer> I am not an American</disclaimer>
      It really amazes me (an Australian) how convoluted your election system is. I do not claim that our system is the best, but at least it is simple.
      When I change addresses, I have to notify the Electoral Comission [] of my new address. Based on that, they tell me which electorate I can vote in for local, state and federal elections. All voting in Australia uses the same system. There are no varieties in the method.It is simple and proven. (Actually, they
      • There are actually a lot of things you don't see going on. First is 99.9% of US elections are working. But we all know that good news does not sell papers (or eyeball time). And some wannabes got their 15 minutes of sleazy fame in the middle of the last over-hyped scandal.

        US citizens get to vote on a lot of things at every election. Not just the President, but US Senators (think house of Lords), US Represenatives (house of commons), State Governor, Lt. Governor, State Senate, State Assembly, State board

    • That's how elections work. It's in the Democrat's interests to muck-rake any Republican crimes, and it's in the Republican's interest to muck-rake any Democrat crimes.

      I agree with you that there is a market for somebody who can synthesize all this into an overview of American election flaws. And I don't think Carter is that person. He has a lot of integrity, but he is a Democrat partisan.

      (Two other Carter bits: in 1980 Carter himself made a concession speech before the polls closed on the west coast, d
    • Not a word about the estimated 15000-20000 voters in the FL panhandle (generally a Republican area) who didn't vote after the networks called the election for Gore before the polls closed in the panhandle.

      No matter how hard you try you can't solve stupidity. That people in the panhandle couldn't be bothered to get out of their Lay-Z-Boys and get to the polls isn't really Carter's concern. He's more concerned with issues like the disenfranchisement of thousands of black voters by the Republican controlled

    • Re:Carter? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by GOD_ALMIGHTY ( 17678 )
      Several points of contention here.

      1. The voting machines used in the Venezuelan elections is from a Florida company with no ties to Chavez. There was a local Democratic candidate for Elections Supervisor in the Primary here in Hillsborough (he lost) who is a) runs an anti-Chavez group and b) a systems engineer at Verizon. I talked with him at length about the company in question and their product. They have produced source code for the product and it has all the safeguards that people here regularly compla

      • brought up the issues he felt were most gregarious

        Aw, I know you meant egregious, but your word, too, seems to fit in this discussion...

  • Score 0, Off-Topic (Score:3, Interesting)

    by TheSHAD0W ( 258774 ) on Monday September 27, 2004 @06:02PM (#10367123) Homepage
    I vote we discontinue the Politics category on Slashdot. The end result of this new category has been a venue for flames and nothing else. There are other forums for discussion on these issues; why clutter up a site dedicated to science and technology?
  • by pauldy ( 100083 ) on Monday September 27, 2004 @06:54PM (#10367540) Homepage
    From the anything to get bush out of office department:

    Yet another case of the slashdot editorial bias. It isn't the governors job to take care of these issues. It may make for more sensational headlines to link them in this way but it is a lie and for gods sake the state has just been hit by three hurricanes in a row. Not to mention the articles lack of anything but subjective factoids that do nothing but stir emotion when invoked out of context.
    • The politics section has been mindless neohippy bullshit from the start. I am shocked and dismayed to find supporters of Bush more reasonable and consistent than the idiots in the ABB camp.
    • The basis for the article come from the president with the highest interest rates in the 20TH Century, and a complete lack of concept of how to handle a hostage situation. I served on a Fast Attack Submarine during Teeth's administration. You can't imagine the constant change of Rules of Engagement, objectives, methods..... From the top down, no one knew what info they wanted, or would approve a realistic method of getting it. A complete lack of leadership. People let him supervise elections?
      • The real scarey part, is that JC was a U-boat commander.
        • He never made it that far. He was a Nuc qualified Junior Officer, I think an LT or LTjg when his father died and he got an early out to run the peanut farm. He was not designated as qualified for command. The one good thing he did was force Rickover into retirement when his senility was causing more harm than good.
  • ok i don't normally do grammar correction posts but this one is a pet peeve of mine, so please excuse:

    That word, 'aka', does not mean what you think it means. aka is an abbreviation for "also known as". it is used for pseudonyms, aliases, nicknames, working names, legalized names, pen names, noms de plume, maiden names etc. In this case, Jeb Bush IS the brother of G.W. Bush, and so on. It's not a nick name or anything else.

    thanks, and yes there are typos in this post!

  • doh. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by TheLink ( 130905 ) on Tuesday September 28, 2004 @12:00AM (#10369989) Journal
    That's a distraction from the main issue:

    Why can't convicted felons vote? If they are still citizens they should get to vote.

    Maybe someone should ask Bush and Kerry what they think.

    Why should alleged felons be disqualified? What next - people with p2p software on their computers not being allowed to vote?

    I think the US should stop claiming superlatives for its brand of democracy.
  • by pudge ( 3605 ) *
    Who cares what Carter thinks or says? In our last two wars he has undermined our efforts, both before and during the war. In 1991, he even secretly wrote to the UN Security Council members to tell them to not support Bush's effort to liberate Kuwait. Carter thinks our State Department -- run by Colin Powell -- is racist.

    While we are on the subject of elections in Florida, the OSCE -- the international group supposedly monitoring elections in the US this year -- is run by a left-win Democrat who was impe
  • Didn't Carter endorse the last Cuban election as a model of fairness? I seem to remember something to that effect a few years ago. I guess it was fair, after all, there was only one candidate for president.

Help! I'm trapped in a PDP 11/70!