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The Almighty Buck Politics

Mayday PAC Goes 2 For 8 224

An anonymous reader writes: Lawrence Lessig's Mayday.us project had a bold goal: create a super PAC to end all super PACs. It generated significant support and raised over $10 million, which it spent endorsing a group of candidates for the recent mid-term elections and the primaries beforehand. The results weren't kind. Only two of the eight candidates backed by Mayday won their elections, and both of those candidates were quite likely to win anyway. Lessig was understandably displeased with the results. In a post on the Mayday site, he said, "What 2014 shows most clearly is the power of partisanship in our elections. Whatever else voters wanted, they wanted first their team to win."

Kenneth Vogel, author of Big Money, a recent book on the rise of super PACs, was critical of of Mayday's efforts, saying, "While voters do express high levels of disgust about the state of campaign finance and the level of corruption in Washington, they tend to actually cast votes more on bread-and-butter economic issues." Still, Lessig is hopeful for the future: "We moved voters on the basis of that message. Not enough. Not cheaply enough. But they moved."
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Mayday PAC Goes 2 For 8

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  • by BarbaraHudson ( 3785311 ) <barbara.jane.hud ... minus physicist> on Sunday November 09, 2014 @08:26AM (#48344687) Journal

    The results weren't kind. Only two of the eight candidates backed by Mayday won their elections, and both of those candidates were quite likely to win anyway. "Whatever else voters wanted, they wanted first their team to win."

    Well, duh! Most people don't want to switch because that would mean they were wrong before.

    "We moved voters on the basis of that message. Not enough. Not cheaply enough. But they moved."

    Not really ...

    Until you get proportional representation (which actually gives 3rd parties a chance) it's going to be "Partisanship For The Win!"

    • by flyneye ( 84093 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @09:05AM (#48344825) Homepage

      Here, even the Democrats voted Republican. Our Democrats were clearly too far left for the red state this is.
      We put back in a Governor that few actually like, because the Dem was a known tax and spend 'crat. We got rid of one of those last election, stupid Sebilius wound up running the Omamacare website. Dumb, right? Put a fuck-up in charge of a mission critical task. Typical Obama.

      We put a lazy absentee senator (Pat Roberts) back in because the Democrats dropped out of the race to support an "independent" that out 'cratted the Democrats, bobbled his head when he talked and avoided taking a stand on any issue that might show him to be a Democrat in disguise. Honestly, he must've thought the state were simple peasant rubes.

      Politics here aren't as complicated as the babbling heads would have you think. No special situation or formula at work here. Libertarians took 2-4% of the vote wherever they appeared.

      Mostly the Repubs just had to show up and give the usual, "no new taxes, no gay marriage, no illegal immigrants, No Obamacare, keep your guns, keep your money,keep your dignity" and they were in like they were covered in KY Jelly. The Dems just did the usual "We can raise a tax to fix this, we can be stylishly modern on social issues, we'll do it for the kids, we'll save the Illegal Aliens, we'll impose the latest greatest socialist philosophies and turn your state into a hippy heaven.
      This is Kansas. We even re-elected Chris Kobach, who penned the infamous Arizona immigration law as well as ours. Democrats have fucked Kansas every time they accidentally get elected. No miracles here. This is a red state and going to stay that way, because of that. But on the bright side we can have Kansas made clips for our guns with any amount of bullets, assault rifles, short shotguns and marijuana is still illegal, untaxed and cheap. GO CHIEFS!

      • ... But on the bright side we can have Kansas made clips for our guns with any amount of bullets, assault rifles, short shotguns and marijuana is still illegal, untaxed and cheap.

        I lost it on those last three words. Good post.

      • by Livius ( 318358 )

        he must've thought the state were simple peasant rubes.

        You seem to be agreeing with his assessment.

      • by binarstu ( 720435 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @01:36PM (#48345799)

        Democrats have fucked Kansas every time they accidentally get elected. No miracles here. This is a red state and going to stay that way, because of that.

        You think that's why Brownback got re-elected as governor? If your analysis were even remotely correct, he would have had absolutely no chance at winning on Tuesday: he's led your state [washingtonpost.com] to huge upcoming budget deficits, an increased poverty rate, much lower economic growth than all four neighboring states, and a downgraded state credit rating.

        Yet, despite all of the above, Brownback still kept his job, because, you know... "liberals and taxes are bad." Never mind if the alternative is flushing your state down the toilet.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      Well, duh! Most people don't want to switch because that would mean they were wrong before.

      Either that or money doesn't buy votes as much as some believe it does. We've already seen numerous times where throwing a lot of money after a particular cause still causes it to lose anyways. Like the Colorado recall elections where the incumbents raised some 11 times what the opposition raised, yet they still lost, some of them by a landslide.

      I mean the two that Lessig's camp won...how easy would it be to argue that Lessig's camp CAUSED them to win?

      • I mean the two that Lessig's camp won...how easy would it be to argue that Lessig's camp CAUSED them to win?

        I thought they were pretty safe incumbents, so I don't think Lessig mattered much there.

        • I thought they were pretty safe incumbents, so I don't think Lessig mattered much there.

          Correct, but my point is that this is often the case anyways. It could just be that the more popular candidate is able to draw funds easier. It probably follows that they're likely to win anyways, even without huge funding dollars.

          Though what I just said was a bit of an oversimplification, and doesn't explain one other point I made, so I'll expand on that. For example in the Colorado recall election, the incumbents were more popular with out of state interests, but those out of state interests couldn't vote

      • Either that or money doesn't buy votes as much as some believe it does.

        Big-spending campaigns probably give voters the impression that the candidate is already "plugged into the system" and is not really going to represent the average voter. Look at what happened with Palin once she went credit-card-crazy buying fancy outfits for herself and her family.

        Plus, if you're spending all that money, people who would have voted for you figure you'll be a shoe-in, so they don't go and vote.

        And of course, if you can't "buy" all that fancy advertising, you have to get out your ground

      • Another thing about that spending, too -- election advertising this year ran about $3.7 billion overall. This is real cash, but it's about real issues and the future of our nation is at stake and many policy proposals could make a significant impact in the nation's $3 trillion-a-year economy. Proctor and Gamble spends about $5 billion a year advertising for the likes of laundry detergent, Nyquil, and diapers.
        • the future of our nation is at stake

          When is it ever NOT at stake?

        • Oh and BTW:

          Proctor and Gamble spends about $5 billion a year advertising for the likes of laundry detergent, Nyquil, and diapers.

          Proctor and gamble needs to advertise 24/7/365. Politicians don't.

          • maybe someone should tell them that then because it seems to me that obama has done more campaigning in the past 6 years than running the country
      • That's because money is not the issue. Psychology is. Money is just the scapegoat to avoid addressing that. We don't want people realizing that they are responsible for the people they elect. So, let's blame the 'system'. There are few buckets in this world that contain more crap.

      • Well, duh! Most people don't want to switch because that would mean they were wrong before.

        Either that or money doesn't buy votes as much as some believe it does.

        Absolutely correct. The true currency of politics is votes not money. Its still a one person one vote system, not a one dollar one vote system. The 99% actually have the power, they just fail to use it.

        Money is just a tool to persuade the indifferent voters and money's influence is magnified by party loyalty. If you are loyal to your party you are irrelevant. Your party can ignore you because they have your vote, the other party can ignore you because they can not get your vote.

        There is a simple way f

        • This is true, but the whole reason the NRA and AARP are effective is that they have large numbers of people who will actually show up and ruin political careers over one vote in Congress. You have to have enormous unanimity in your organization to make it work. What's the single "99%" issue that you think you can make millions of people take that kind of stand?
          • This is true, but the whole reason the NRA and AARP are effective is that they have large numbers of people who will actually show up and ruin political careers over one vote in Congress. You have to have enormous unanimity in your organization to make it work. What's the single "99%" issue that you think you can make millions of people take that kind of stand?

            An elected official egregiously voting against the interests of the people, of demonstrating a far greater loyalty to campaign contributions than to votes. The point being to punish those politicians who consider voters secondary to donors, and to tolerate politicians who consider donors secondary to voters. Ie to remind politicians where the true power lies. And "tolerate" doesn't necessarily mean voting for, it simply means returning to voting on a politician's stance on issues when neither candidate warr

  • "While voters do express high levels of disgust about the state of campaign finance and the level of corruption in Washington, they tend to actually cast votes more on bread-and-butter economic issues."

    But voters are easily convinced that if their freedom to form a corporate monopoly is central to their own economic future. I know a guy who drives a school bus and is worried sick about the estate tax.

  • Capitalism. (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday November 09, 2014 @08:31AM (#48344707)

    The government is just another business, and people will want to buy pieces of it.

    You can't put a band-aid over an asshole to stop the spread of shit. It's a problem inherent to the system.

    • by drfred79 ( 2936643 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @11:18AM (#48345311)
      If the government was actually a corporation it wouldn't be losing money and it would function well at what it set out to do.
      • Businesses die off or fail all the time. Being a business isn't some magical code-word for guaranteed success. Businesses that turn into de facto monopolies like a government tend to suck and do a crap job because they really don't have to care and there's no competition. Look at Comcast and tell me that you'd want that for a government. Every bit as inept and rent seeking.

        If we wanted a system that took the best aspects of capitalism, you'd let the states compete to see who can do the best job to win th
        • >If we wanted a system that took the best aspects of capitalism, you'd let the states compete to see who can do the best job to win the chance to run the country as a whole.

          no, we'd just have more of the same.

          companies succeede when they recruit great workers. Once they get big enough, the bosses get arrogant, and fool themselves into beleiving their own propaganda about that they themselves built the company, and any worker could accomplish the work at hand. Once this happens, its a slow down hill.

          Capit
      • not neccarily. Many businesses suck at what they do, they just suck less than the next business, and stay in business through a combination of volume of scale, and a handful of previous successes.

        Truth is, There are very few businesses that have lasted as long as the US government. Most don't make it 100 years. Most don't have the faintest idea what keeps them in business, or how they got to where they are, especially after a few generations of founding, and all the original talent has gone, and then fail w
  • There were plenty of SuperPACs that raised more than that for individual races this election cycle, and these were midterm elections. In 2016 $10M will be chump change for election fundraising.

    If Citizens United sought to disenfranchise voters as much as possible from the election process, they will accomplish it once that election is over and voters feel that their money can no longer help out in any meaningful way.
    • If Citizens United sought to disenfranchise voters as much as possible from the election process...

      Citizens United is a group (of citizens, who are also presumably voters) that runs ads to convince voters to vote for candidates that support specific policies. Citizens United is effective because people have the franchise.

      If we lived in a horrible dictatorship where there was one party rule, and being a member of the other party was a crime (think North Korea or the old Soviet Union or something), running ads saying "Vote against the guy in power" wouldn't work.

      • by Anonymous Coward

        No, Citizens United was a front group. It used the whole group of citizens argument as an excuse to push their agenda through, which was to open the door for unfettered corporate spending.

        I have yet to see any credible evidence that citizens were ever denied participation in the political process. Corporations on the other hand, were unable to use their outsized budgets to buy influence. That is what this case was all about, and attempts to dress it up as anything else is just more astroturfing.

        • No, Citizens United was a front group. It used the whole group of citizens argument as an excuse to push their agenda through, which was to open the door for unfettered corporate spending.

          I have yet to see any credible evidence that citizens were ever denied participation in the political process.

          Citizens United is a group of citizens. It's a small one. It may not be as large as you'd like, but it IS a group of citizens who spent their money in concert with each other.

          My examples of a "a horrible one party dictatorship" were Iran and the USSR, by the way. I'm not accusing Lessig or Democrats or whoever of trying to deny people participation in the political process.

          • by Creepy ( 93888 )

            Incidentally, the USSR largely chose that for themselves. Lenin wanted Trotsky in charge and Trotsky wanted the party to elect a leader democratically. Unfortunately, Stalin grabbed power in the wake of Lenin's death and exiled Trotsky, convicted him of treason in absentia and eventually had one of his secret service agents assassinate him with an ice axe in Mexico.

        • by Attila Dimedici ( 1036002 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @09:41AM (#48344961)
          You really should spend some time learning about that which you speak. Citizens United was a group formed to oppose Hillary Clinton's run for President. They made a documentary about her career that they intended to distribute leading up to the primaries (and then the general election) in 2008. When the FEC told them that they were not allowed to do so within a certain number of days of the election because it violated campaign finance laws, they sued.
          I remember reading about them as they gathered support and money to make the movie. Several prominent members in Citizens United had been speaking out against a Hillary Clinton presidency for several years at that point. So, the idea that this group was formed solely to challenge election finance law is ludicrous.
  • by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @08:42AM (#48344741)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • Hypocrites (Score:5, Informative)

    by JWW ( 79176 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @08:55AM (#48344787)

    I think the biggest thing Mayday PAC did wrong is that they were, in the end, massive hypocrites.

    Their "competition" for the best video about the effect of big money was such an enormous debacle and a clear showing that their true goal was not to get money out of politics, but to get Conservative (and even libertarian) money out of politics. Their embracing and providing cover for Tom Steyer, who openly talked about influencing elections with large amounts of his money, makes Mayday PAC a bunch of liars.

    http://freebeacon.com/politics... [freebeacon.com]

    If Mayday were true to its stated vision, they would have condemned Steyer's actions. That they did not condemn him like they constantly did the Koch brothers proves that they don't really want what they say they want.

    On top of this, their support for a constitutional amendment that would allow congress to restrict speech, makes them a contemptable organization.

    I really respect Lessig's views on copyrights and patents. His efforts with his Mayday PAC have made me lose great amounts of respect for him.

    • On top of this, their support for a constitutional amendment that would allow congress to restrict speech, makes them a contemptible organization.

      I searched around a bit and this is what I found:

      Our plan for reform has four stages:

      3. In 2017, we will then press to get Congress to pass, and the President to sign, legislation that fundamentally reforms the way elections are funded.

      4. After a Congress has been elected under this new system, we will push for whatever constitutional reform is necessary to secure the gains from this reform.

      Is there some non-campaign finance related restrictions on speech that they're endorsing?
      If so, I'm not aware of it and I'd like to know more.

      • Re:Hypocrites (Score:4, Insightful)

        by jmac_the_man ( 1612215 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @11:12AM (#48345287)

        Is there some non-campaign finance related restrictions on speech that they're endorsing? If so, I'm not aware of it and I'd like to know more.

        No, the restrictions on who can run campaign advertisements are the free speech restrictions that cause people to oppose Lessig's group (and other groups, like Wolf PAC, which have the same goals.)

        Think about it like this. Think about the percentage of "straight news" stories that are in fact supporting one candidate or opposing the other. Most of them, right?

        That's the media. Those stories don't get covered by Lessig's restrictions, but ads in favor of the guy the media opposes are restricted. That's the big problem with Mayday style free speech restrictions. It lets some people and some corporations (media corporations and the people who run them) are allowed to say, print, or broadcast whatever they want to affect the election, but everyone else will get penalized by the government for trying to affect the election.

        Lessig's big bet is that the media will agree with him and support his guys more often. That's the problem with Mayday.

        • No, the restrictions on who can run campaign advertisements are the free speech restrictions that cause people to oppose Lessig's group (and other groups, like Wolf PAC, which have the same goals.)

          You talk about free speech and yet you seem to ignore the history that brought us the previous limits on such "speech."

          If all limits on political spending are unconstitutional, then the natural result is going to be a Constitutional Amendment to reestablish 100 years worth of legislation that reduces the corrupting influence of money in politics.

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
      • oh hai there hairyfeet, its been a while.

        Once again, your back with false equvilance, mistating cause, effect, or actual conditions on the ground for some hypothetical solution, then ignoring whatever facts don't suit you.
    • by unity ( 1740 )
      "Their "competition" for the best video about the effect of big money was such an enormous debacle and a clear showing that their true goal was not to get money out of politics, but to get Conservative (and even libertarian) money out of politics"

      And worth mentioning. If you look at the top 10 spending SuperPACs in the last cycle, you'll find that the left-leaning PACs outspent the right-leaning PACs by more than double.

      The top 3 super pac disbursements this cycle were from the left: NextGen Climate, Se

  • Ideology (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ChrisMaple ( 607946 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @09:11AM (#48344847)
    Most people - about 80% by some estimates - have a fairly clear idea of what they believe, and that belief corresponds roughly to either the Democrat or Republican party. They vote according to their belief, not "Yay my team". Lessig's view is far too shallow, and in all likelihood he's blind to his own bias.
    • I disagree, at least here in Texas. If you actually talk to people, a very large percentage of people have a very clear idea of libertarianism in their heads. That isn't how they vote, though.

      • Because libertarians and any other 3rd party can't win until we get run-off elections.
      • This is true in states other than Texas too, from my experience.

        People with clear libertarian ideas will often vote for a Republican, simply because he (or she?) makes some libertarian-esque comments while campaigning.

        Libertarians tend to try to "sell" their political beliefs on the idea that "Democrats already agree with half of what we're saying, because we're liberal like them on all the social issues .... gay marriage rights, marijuana legalization, etc.", and "Republicans already agree with half of wha

    • by Kjella ( 173770 )

      The problem is that there's a degree of objection. Here in Norway we currently have 8 parties in parliament, one is a single representative but the other seven fairly well split into two left, three center, two right, though some in the center are more left/right leaning than others. What it means though is that there's a choice to say you want darker/lighter blue/red or that you kind of like the politics, but your party has pissed me off. The elections are actually a bit more of a cluster fuck with coaliti

    • Most people - about 80% by some estimates - have a fairly clear idea of what they believe, and that belief corresponds roughly to either the Democrat or Republican party.

      Furthermore, each party makes an effort to change as popular opinions change. This is especially true of regional elections. The Republican who got elected in California is different than the Republican who got elected in Kansas.

      Mostly I'm just hoping to get representatives who aren't too incompetent, and who don't mess things up too much. I don't have hope for them to not mess things up a little bit.

    • by Kohath ( 38547 )

      They just need people like Lessig to tell them they're stupid and/or evil more often. Then they'll be convinced to vote for Lessig's priorities instead of their own.

    • almost everyone I've met IRL, votes democrat or republican because its expected of their social group. 90% of their beliefs come around some vast conspiracy theory started by the other party, that they are brave political soliders working to stop. They over-analyze every last thing everyone from the other group says or does to fit the conspiracy, to self-affirm their beleifs to generate more conspiracy.
    • Not quite. Most people are conditioned with a fairly clear idea of what they should believe, corresponding to the party they self-identify with. There are countless examples on both sides of the two-party divide of people literally adopting the direct opposite position to the one that they had, because over time their party flipped on it.

  • by jmac_the_man ( 1612215 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @09:14AM (#48344861)

    What 2014 shows most clearly is the power of partisanship in our elections. Whatever else voters wanted, they wanted first their team to win.

    Maybe they showed that. Or maybe they showed that the voters don't want to put Lawrence Lessig in charge of determining who gets free speech and who does not. Maybe the voters think that individuals shouldn't lose their right to express their support for a candidate financially just because they're acting in a group. Maybe the voters think that the voters should be exposed to more information on a candidate than just what the news shows them, because the news goes out of its way to favor certain candidates and certain policies. Maybe the voters think that campaign finance laws invariably turn into incumbent protection schemes, and they think there's a lot of crappy incumbents. In short, maybe the voters rejected Lessig's idea because they think it's a bad idea.

    Also, this was a wave election for Republicans. I wouldn't expect anyone using Communist imagery (and who launched on a Communist holiday*) to do well in this environment.

    *If a leftist wants to convince me that his organization, which is named after a website URL and so can't contain a space, should be interpreted as "Mayday" rather than "May Day," there are 364 better days to launch the organization on than May 1st. You'll note Wolf PAC doesn't have this problem.

    • Or maybe they showed that the voters don't want to put Lawrence Lessig in charge of determining who gets free speech and who does not. Maybe the voters think that individuals shouldn't lose their right to express their support for a candidate financially just because they're acting in a group.

      This was the first result for mid-term election spending that I found.
      Feel free to dig up an alternative source of numbers
      http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2014/11/money-won-on-tuesday-but-rules-of-the-game-changed/ [opensecrets.org]
      FYI - I cleaned up their word salad into a more digestible format

      Democratic House candidates - average per candidate
      2010 general election: $106,494 from donors of $200 or less, 8.8 percent of the average total from individuals.
      2014 general election: $89,194 from donors of $200 or less, 9.4 percent of the average total from individuals.

      House GOP candidates - average per candidate
      2010 general election: $153,209 from donors of $200 or less, 13.8 percent of the average total from individuals.
      2014 general election: $85,118 from donors of $200 or less, 7.3 percent of the average total from individuals.

      Democratic Senate candidates - average per candidate
      2010 general election: $923,000 from donors of $200 or less, 12.2 percent of the average total from individuals.
      2014 general election: $1,450,000 from donors of $200 or less, 17.2 percent of the average total from individuals.

      GOP Senate candidates - average per candidate
      2010 general election: $1,600,000 from donors of $200 or less, 16.3 percent of the average total from individuals.
      2014 general election: $508,275 from donors of $200 or less, 8.1 percent of the average total from individuals.

      The numbers are very clear.
      House and Senate Republicans got significantly less from small donors this mid-term cycle.
      House Democrats got less from small donors and (seemingly a lot) less from large donors.
      Senate Democrats got a lot mo

      • The numbers are very clear. House and Senate Republicans got significantly less from small donors this mid-term cycle. House Democrats got less from small donors and (seemingly a lot) less from large donors. Senate Democrats got a lot more from small donors.

        You can't draw any clear line between these numbers and what voters think of MAYDAY PAC, but it does seem to show that small donors (aka the average voter) were significantly less interested in supporting the winners this election cycle.

        I didn't check the accuracy of the numbers in terms of whether the Center for Responsive Politics' numbers are true, but they don't mean what you say they do. The numbers you are quoting are for individual donors. To my knowledge, Lessig's group isn't concerned with individual donors. He's only concerned with Political Action Committees, or PACs.

        In terms of the impact of PACs vs. individuals, your source, the CRP, says

        Of the money raised by Senate and House campaigns, CRP’s analysis shows, the bulk still came from individual donors (as opposed to PACs)

        The CRP is a lefty anti-"bad" money in politics group. They're against PACs too. If t

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by davydagger ( 2566757 )
      so now, we just have "whoever has enough money to spend" is in charge of determining Free Speech.

      >Maybe the voters think that the voters should be exposed to more information on a candidate than just what the news shows them, because the news goes out of its way to favor certain candidates and certain policies.

      The news is biased, solution: unlimited political advertisements, which are surely non-partisan in nature. Surely you jest. Your solution for somewhat biased news, is purely %100 subjective informa
  • by davmoo ( 63521 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @09:16AM (#48344869)

    Yeah, partisanship has some to do with it. But the biggest problem that Mayday.us faces is apathy and the fact that nationally 62 percent of those legally eligible to vote did not do so.

    If you are American and you voted Tuesday, regardless of who you voted for, good for you! But if you did not vote and you were legally entitled to do so, go look in the mirror and you'll see why American government is as fucked up as it is. When 62 percent of eligible voters do not do so, America gets the government it deserves. And don't give me that "My not voting is a protest!" bullshit. All you do by not voting is magnify the voting power of the far right, which is the group most likely to go vote in American elections, and is the very group that is most likely to support the leaders you do not like.

    • by Ichijo ( 607641 )
      I left some of the items on my ballot blank. I thought it was better to let people who care about those candidates and issues decide, instead of voting along party lines. Is this bad?
      • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward

        Why not become the person who cares about the candidates and issues? Even if just quietly and personally. There are some sites out there like BallotPedia that are a great resource when an upcoming election is near. It'll show you the positions up for election, the candidates, and any additional questions/measures that will be on the ballot. Some night before the election, look at the people up for election, spend a little time looking at their accomplishments (or lack thereof) and what they advocate, make a

    • by Kohath ( 38547 )

      Someone who doesn't care enough to vote probably doesn't care enough to find out anything about the candidates either. If you drag them into the polls, they'll vote based on whichever guy had the most ads run against him. Unmotivated voters give money more influence in elections, not less.

  • Perhaps, particularly in this last election cycle, the money would be better spent in the primaries. Clearly, the American voters wanted the Democrats to lose control of the Senate and to retain control of the House. For a number of reasons, that was the overriding issue, across the board.

    If Lessig's PAC had worked to get more favorable candidates into position in the primaries, they might have had a bigger return on their dollar.

  • Proved that their hypothesis about the effect of big money on voting was wrong.

  • He's complaining that the money he spent to defeat the influence of money in politics didn't have any influence.

    The proper lesson is that his basic thesis is wrong, that money doesn't always win elections. Meg Whitman was another example (if you have to ask who she? and what election? then you prove my point -- google "meg whitman election").

    But being a statist fuck, that won't be the lesson he sees. Lessig's done a lot of nice work otherwise, but he's off the rails on this.

  • > "What 2014 shows most clearly is the power of partisanship in our elections.

    Duh. That is why NOTHING is going to change until we have preferential voting, such as instant runoff. Then people can vote their conscience and get new blood into power (independents, libertarians, other parties, etc) without fear of a party opposite of their view being unopposed. Otherwise it is just business as usual.

    http://www.fairvote.org/ [fairvote.org]
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R... [wikipedia.org]
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I... [wikipedia.org]

  • by dfenstrate ( 202098 ) <dfenstrate.gmail@com> on Sunday November 09, 2014 @10:02AM (#48345057)
    ....of politics. They want conservative money out of politics. With the entertainment industry in lefty hands and most journalists* little more than Democratic party operatives with bylines, the Democrats have plenty of influence already.

    What they want to do is choke out conservative money, because that's the primary way Republicans get heard when leftists control the culture.

    Mayday PAC is transparent in this regard- they ran a video contest accepting amateur-made ads supporting their cause. A video attacking Tom Steyer, the left's Koch, won the popular vote by a large margin. They picked another video based on the 'judgement of their panel of experts.'

  • Why did they spend money on the campaigns of candidates who were already quite likely to win? That seems like a suboptimal way to spend the funds at their disposal. Spend it exclusively on races where it might make a difference.
  • See subject

    • Political Action Campaign, Pretty a group that is not part of any major political group so they can say any BS they want about one of the candidates true or not, Mostly they are lies. If i remember right they have the ability to donate unlimited amount of money to a parties campaign which they can get unlimited amount from a donator.
    • Thanks! I was beginning to think I was the only person who didn't know. I've seen the acronym before as Pre-Authorized Contribution, but I couldn't make any contextual leap to what a SuperPAC might be.
  • I spent 20 years as a political consultant, so I have a strong understanding of what it takes to win elections. Although Lawrence Lessig is a smart guy, he makes the mistake that's common to many other smart people. He assumes his intelligence and knowledge about one field should make conquering another field simple and easy. He's wrong in his diagnosis of the problem with U.S. politics and he's even more laughably wrong about how change happens. It's amazingly arrogant for him to believe that his tiny effo
  • by stomv ( 80392 ) on Sunday November 09, 2014 @01:01PM (#48345665) Homepage

    For Lessig's group to be successful, they need to stay out of the general election, and away from third parties.

    1. Stay out of the general. Most congressional districts lean just enough Democrat or Republican than supporting the "favored" candidate is a waste of resources and favoring the "unfavored" candidate is too. If the race really is close, then (a) it will get really expensive, and (b) that candidate isn't likely to still be in Congress 10 years from now -- it's a tough district!

    Instead, fight in the primaries. Go to districts where the Dem or Repub candidate is sure to win the general, whomever he or she is. Then, find like-minded candidates of that party willing to run in a primary. A primary race is cheaper and easier to influence -- and if you win it, you'll coast through the general and coast through reelections. Invest in both Democratic and Republican primaries, getting candidates who want the kind of campaign finance reform Lessig's group wants, and to hell with the rest of it. Bonus if the primary is "open" -- that is, there is no incumbent.

    2. Stay away from third party candidates. First of all, they almost never win. There are what, two in the Senate (VT and ME senators Sanders and King, respectively), and zero in the House if memory serves. That's 2 out of 535. Terrible odds. Secondly, even if they do win -- they're independents! Their opinions change rather easily! They're unpredictable, and they take pride on being "mavericky." Look at the independents who gave good runs in 2014 -- very hard to predict where they would come down on the details of any campaign finance reform.

    Lessig mistakenly got behind independents, foolishly believing that they had a shot in hell at winning. He also spent too much money in November, when the real action is between June and September.

  • 2 for 8.

    Thats actually a good start, for a first election.

    I don't know why people expect rapid ground moving change to happen over night. If mayday was a real grassroots movement, it'd take it a long time for its people to gain the experiance enough to compete with corporate firms with lots of experiance. The demands of organizations full of unexperianced people to compete with proffesionals overnight is the reason why activist movements fail.

    For a new concept its doing well considering how young it is.
  • ....so lets take advantage of that with a Super PAC.

    Sounds legit.

  • Whatever else voters wanted, they wanted first their team to win.

    As opposed to wanting the team they are most philosophically opposed to to win, which would of course make so much more sense.

    Wha??

Children begin by loving their parents. After a time they judge them. Rarely, if ever, do they forgive them. - Oscar Wilde

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