Secession Petitions Flood White House Website 1163
First time accepted submitter RNLockwood writes "Political.com reports that several petitions to secede from the Union have been created at the White House site, We The People, for many states; all since Obama's re-election. Texas and Louisiana lead the list with Texas needing only 7,000 more signatures to qualify for a White House response, probably less now as more Americans have become aware of the petitions. It would be interesting to see a comparison done of these petitions and the Post Election Racist Tweets Map."
If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
..you'd find these states well ranked.
Secession is an economically unviable option. If you want copious analyses ask the Quebec'ers.
We in the US seem to have a hard time admitting when we are wrong. Mitt was a dreadful choice for a conservative presidential candidate. Obama's winning the election was not a sign that the poor Texans are oppressed. They simply picked a moderate who had to pivot to the right of Rick Perry to win the primaries, and then back to the center to have a chance in the final election. I don't think anyone could have done that job any better than Mitt did, but even with 3 to 1 outspending of their opponents it wasn't enough. I sent my $100 to Buddy Roemer to try to get an honest man into the race, and honesty lost.
So, please quit your whining and next time pick an actuall conservative. Pick someone with a tax plan that adds up, low spending, little war-lust, and who understands what a disaster the "personhood" amendment would be, and then you'll have a race.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
Can't we at least let them try it this time?
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:4, Insightful)
Can't we at least let them try it this time?
Note: This is some random guy in a state requesting it for his entire state. I'd say the answer should be: ask your duly elected representatives, not me, the President.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
It would save us a shitload of tax money and we would no longer have to worry about the American taliban getting their voice in our laws.
http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2012/09/who-receives-the-disproportionate-share-of-government-spending.html [typepad.com]
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
Also we could stand to shed a state so we won't have to buy new flags when Puerto Rico becomes a state.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
Sorry no. On behalf of all Mexicans, Texans can stay in the USA or become independent, but we don't want them back.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
* There were 20 surplus states and 30 deficit states.
* Of the 24 states that voted for Romney, 4 of them had a surplus.
* Of the 26 states that voted for Obama, 16 of them had a surplus.
* Together, the blue states had a net surplus of 2.57 trillion, the red states had a net deficit of 1.50 trillion.
* The average blue state had a surplus of 98.8 billion; the average red state had a deficit of 63.0 billion.
* Four blue states (New York, New Jersey, Illinois, and Minnesota) each had a surplus greater than all the red states with a surplus combined.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
It ought to be acceptable to register dissatisfaction with the election results in this free country of ours.
There's a difference between registering your dissatisfaction and being a whiny childish douchebag. These secessionists fall into the latter category.
The way to avoid this is to work with the opposition and hammer out compromises. The Democrats failed to compromise from 2008-2010, feeling they didn't need to, and in 2010 they reaped the results.
It's laughable that you think it's the Democrats that need to compromise.
The point is, Obama does not have a strong mandate and would do well to incorporate some of the moderate and conservative fiscal ideas into his policies going forward.
I guarantee you that if Romney had won by the same electoral margin, we'd be hearing nothing but "mandate" being screamed from the right.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes quite. This is the perfect example of a "states rights" issue. If you want to succeed then you need to have a local succession convention in your own state. Dragging the "enemy" in Washington into it really seems beyond absurd.
It's like genuine fire eaters petitioning Lincoln.
These people are too stupid to even know what they're asking for.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
It's "secede", not "succeed".
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
Why do you assume that every action is done of a genuine belief that its going to work? There is often value to a stunt, even if just to make a point. If anything, I think they are the smart ones in this system.
Its like I tell to some Obama supporters who can't stand Obama. They feel like voting for a 3rd party was wasting a vote, as if the consequences of an election end with who gets into office. Imagine the message sent to both parties if Stein, or Johnson handed Obama a loss.
Elections are not about who wins or loses, those are secondary issues. Elections are about what issues politicians feel safe standing on, and what issues they feel they need to fall into line on. These petitions serve a similar purpose...its not about breaking off, its about getting people talking about it, and about making them answer it.
Its definitely a silly tactic, but, I think there is plenty of room for that.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
Imagine the message sent to both parties if Stein, or Johnson handed Obama a loss.
You mean like when Nader handed Gore a loss in 2000?
The lesson the Republicans learned was "we have a mandate" and proceeded to pursue a decade of self-destructive jingoistic policy they still haven't recovered from. The lesson the Democrats learned was "don't get Nadered again."
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:4, Informative)
Imagine the message sent to both parties if Stein, or Johnson handed Obama a loss.
You mean like when Nader handed Gore a loss in 2000?
The lesson the Republicans learned was "we have a mandate" and proceeded to pursue a decade of self-destructive jingoistic policy they still haven't recovered from. The lesson the Democrats learned was "don't get Nadered again."
You must be young - Perot handed the Presidency to Clinton in '92 and '96.
The result of the increasing 3rd party relevance was the only cooperation we could get between the Republicans and Democrats, which was the effective removal of any other party from the election process.
Bastards. All of them.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:4, Funny)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Interesting)
Can't we at least let them try it this time?
I agree, let's call their bluff and say okay you're out of the union. They're mostly the poorest states that use the most welfare and medicaid and medicare per capita. They also push the hardest for declaring war. If we let them go we might actually balance the budget finally. Give all the right wing conservatives a year to relocate to the red state of their choice then close the borders. About the time they realize how bad off they are it'll be too late and the rest of us can finally move forward without the half of Congress that always stonewalls efforts to fix the mess. It's a win win because they get to live in a world of fear and hate and teach their kids about Jesus riding dinosaurs while the rest of us get the economy back on track and fix the pollution problem and finally get energy independent.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
Hence my petition [whitehouse.gov]. Get rid of (some of) the net receivers, gain some much-needed capital to help pay down the national debt in exchange, and as a side effect we have a smaller government to boot.
(For what it's worth, I don't expect to get more than a couple hundred signatures, tops.)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
Let Texas secede, withdraw all the national defense instruments we have in the region, and let them hold off the violent Mexican gangs. They will soon remember the Alamo, and not in a good way.
Not gonna moderate (Score:4, Insightful)
...even though I've got points because this comment is just too out-of-touch to let go without a response.
The Texas secession will go nowhere, of course. However, you've missed a couple of things.
First, the kinds of Texans who actually want to secede wouldn't bother with a wall on the border. They'd set up a 1000-yard-wide no-man's land, pepper it with automated machine gun towers and kill anything that moved. That would be a start on the whole "hold off the violent Mexican gangs" thing.
Second, even more Texans than the sort mentioned in the previous paragraph legally carry concealed weapons and wouldn't hesitate to return fire. The brazen, large-scale Mexican gangs activities seen inside Mexico just wouldn't fly in Texas. There are too many ranchers with too many 7.62s and .50s, and too many LEOs and judges who would simply give them a pat on the back and some reward money for every cartel member they downed.
Finally, the U.S. would never let Texas secede specifically *because* of national defense issues. Remember, the PANTEX plant is in Texas. Texans are the people who make nukes for the USA. A successfully seceeded Texas would instantly become a nuclear-bomb equipped nation. Now, delivery systems would be a problem but I'm sure they could figure out a way.
God, these secession petitions are stupid but if you want to insult Texas, work a little harder, OK?
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
You just backed it up for him. According to the site that you yourself linked there is only one "red" state that pays more in taxes than it gets in federal spending: Texas.
Here's a quick summary, from your own link, of which states support the nation, sorted by the amount they give in excess of the amount they receive:
California: $47B
New Jersey: $32B
New York: $24B
Illinois: $19B
Connecticut: $10B
Texas: $10B
Minnesota: $9B
Massachusetts: $8B
Nevada: $6B
Colorado: $5B
Michigan: $3B
Washington: $3B
Wisconsin $3B
New Hampshire: $2B
Delaware: $1.5B
Oregon: $1B
Florida: $0.5B
That list includes big states, small states, densely populated states, sparse states, coastal states, landlocked states, and so on. The only common thread is that they're all liberal, except Texas. And if we're being honest, Texas only makes the list because of the big liberal cities like Houston that drive their economy.
The fact is that the red states that bitch the most about taxes are also the ones who benefit the most from them. Not unlike their fervently anti-gay congressmen who get caught soliciting sex in the men's room.
Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:4, Informative)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
No. They're the portion of the country that keeps us swilling oil. Look at any oil production map:
Texas, Montana, North Dakota... etc.: red states.
It wouldn't matter a bit, though -- they'd still want to sell oil.
What intrigues me in Texas' case, is that they have been screwing up school books for some time now, and it would be a real boon to the country if somehow, secession resulted in our books being more reality-based. They can keep their "no sex toy" laws and immigrant hating, too... be good to get those kinds of influences out of the country.
For Montana (my state) I'm not sure secession is really any serious goal; first of all, we've got a Democrat governor and senator, and part of the reason we have a Republican congress-critter is gerrymandering. There are some really "red" areas in the state, but there are some really blue ones, too. I expect these petitions are coming from the red areas and won't amount to a thing, even should others succeed (which I doubt, but that's another issue.)
But... we've got a good state constitution, and our legislators and courts have demonstrated -- repeatedly -- that they're willing to abide by it, instead of making up bullshit at the drop of a hat the way SCOTUS does. We have oil, mineral resources, timber and grain. We raise cattle, too. What we don't have is a lot of people. Maybe that would change if coming here meant that you no longer had to worry (for instance) about the government taking your property to build a mall, pretending you have no right to arms, surveilling your communications and banking without warrants, etc.
One thing I honestly think about the US as a whole right now is that it is no longer a constitutional republic. I'd describe it more as a corporate-driven plutocracy. It's not pretty.
OTOH, I don't think a bunch of little countries here would be pretty, either. I give it a rousing "ain't gonna happen" :)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Interesting)
Well, he didn't have a (pick a cliche and insert here) to win, thus my labeling of the vote as a "protest". He was better than the two viable candidates.
I disagree with him on some substantial parts of his platform: ending the Fed (though he's not a huge proponent of that), ending farm subsidies (does he mean all? what about food security?), and I think he shares the same flaw that many Libertarians do when considering corporations: for some reason, they do not see corporations as an example of massive government regulation of the private market, when they clearly are. I also think that the federal government does belong in the EPA business, since many pollution issues cross state boundaries.
That said, I largely agree with him on almost every other issue and he was by far the closest fit for me.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
I call BS on that one. I live in Canada, we also have a first past the post voting system, however we also have 5 major political parties, Conservative, Liberal, New Democrats, Bloc Quebecois, and Green. The Green party is in fact quite new and only won it's first seat in the past couple of elections, however they are quickly growing. This proves that even with a first past the post system, it is possible for new parties to form and be successful.
I'm not sure what it is about the US that makes it impossible to have more than 2 parties, but first past the post isn't it.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
They did pick an actual conservative. Obama. The guy is to the right on Nixon and Reagan on many issues.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
Seriously. I voted for the guy who said he's end the wars and raise taxes, because there's a deficit, yo. The guy who implemented the Heritage Foundation's plan for healthcare, which was based on the idea of individual responsibility paired with a fair and transparent dealing from the insurers. The guy who overthrew the Libyan government under force of arms with four American fatalities, and didn't do the same in Syria because he thought it was too risky. Oh, and he's on the right side on the inclusion of gays, women(!?), immigrants and host of other basic-human-freedom issues that used to be considered part of the conservative promise.
We need a conservative party in this country, and I'm not sure the GOP is going to be it. I think the best thing you could do as a conservative in this country is start electing Greens and then plan to be a Democrat for the next 50 years.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
"Pick someone with a tax plan that adds up, low spending, little war-lust, and who understands what a disaster the "personhood" amendment would be, and then you'll have a race."
Sorry, but Bill Clinton is not eligible to run.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
Clinton was the most warlike president of all since Johnson. At least until Bush Jr went crazy.
Definitely not:
Richard Nixon: Elected on a secret plan to end the Vietnam War in 1968, he expanded it into Laos and Cambodia, two countries who's only crime was being next to Vietnam.
Gerald Ford: Actually made peace in Vietnam. He's not a contender for the "most warlike".
Jimmy Carter: A few minor things, such as trying to rescue the hostages. Also not a contender.
Ronald Reagan: Invaded Grenada, Honduras, ordered various operations against Libya, was on the outskirts of the Iran-Iraq War (supplying weapons to both sides and using US ships to protect Kuwaiti oil tankers).
George H.W. Bush: First Gulf War. Several smaller operations in Panama, Hondurus, and Liberia.
Bill Clinton: Enforcing the no-fly zone in Iraq, air operations in former Yugoslavia, missile strikes on Al Qaida.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm aware I don't watch the same news as most Republicans, but I got the reverse impression. Before he won the primaries he actually did look more moderate than Rick Santorum and Rick Perry. After winning the primaries he picked Ryan, got recorded with the "47%" remark, spoke out more strongly against gay marriage and Planned Parenthood.
Was honestly wondering why he seemed to feel the need to appease the far right instead of the center after already winning the primaries. My only guess was that he feared the far right might get too disgusted with the election to vote if he came off as moderate.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't understand it either. The Republicans have the hick and religious nutter vote locked up, why court them at all?
Playing towards the middle could win an election, but instead they take good middle of the road candidates like McCain and Romney and saddle them with a fringe nutcase VP. Then somehow convince them that it is in their own best interest to act like a far right winger instead of just acting like themselves. Not only does it turn these candidates into liars/flip-floppers but it dirves away votes.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:4, Informative)
"The Republicans have the hick and religious nutter vote locked up, why court them at all?"
Actually, no. Among the bitch-slaps the GOP took this cycle was the fact that, against all expectations, 6 million fewer white people voted than in 2008 (and of course, their population is actually larger) -- http://news.yahoo.com/karl-rove-why-romney-lost-obama-suppressing-vote-215625694.html [yahoo.com]
Meanwhile, increasing voter participation occurred for Blacks and Hispanics. Young people (18-29) cast more votes than old people (65+) for possibly the first time ever -- and they vastly prefer Dems positions on social issues (immigration, health care, women's rights, gay marriage, etc.), breaking 60% for Obama even when most pundits thought they were disenchanted. This demographic trend is only expected to increase -- http://news.yahoo.com/gop-faces-steep-climb-young-voters-080006202--politics.html [yahoo.com]
Arguably, the GOP is between a rock and a hard place; their primary seemingly cannot nominate a person acceptable to the electorate at large. This might even be seen to be the case for the last 20 years if the vote in 2000 had been counted accurately.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
Fair enough. It was an incomplete pivot. In the debates he went right-of-Perry on immigration but wasn't more radical than most of the stage.
But, again, what can you do. You don't want to appear to be an Etch-a-Sketch, but you have to in a split-brained party if you want all their votes. Pleasing the corporations ruins the budgets valued by decent conservatives, pleasing the decent conservatives, irks the religeous zealots. The guy was asked to swim in air. I've no pity for the amount of deceit he employed in this process, but it looked like a pretty impossible job.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
Mitt was a dreadful choice for a conservative presidential candidate.
Romney was a far right conservative presidential candidate, Obama is not "moderate" at all as he is a right wing conservative.
What is bad is America had no left wing candidate at all.
We're going how the rest of the world define political spectrum, not America.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Interesting)
Jill Stein was just a figment of my imagination?
I really do remember marking that box on the ballot.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
Third party candidates are a fantasy. Either fix the system so they have any chance of winning, or just stop spewing this nonsense.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Informative)
What is bad is America had no left wing candidate at all.
That's not true at all - the Green Party fielded a genuinely left-leaning candidate - Jill Stein [wikipedia.org]
I quite like her.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
This election wasn't just about Obama vs Romney, I would argue that wasn't even the most important race taking place, especially given that anyone objective enough to look at actual polling data knew the conclusion before the first ballot was caste on the 6th. If I were a republican, I'd be more worried about the number of senate races they lost. I'd be more worried about the fact that they lost the popular vote if you add up all the house races (only maintaining a 40 seat lead in the house thanks to a metric shit-ton of gerrymandering in 2010). I'd be more worried that 60% of voters think that taxes should go up for the richest people and only 35% thought that taxes shouldn't go up for anyone. And that 65% of voters think there should be a path to legal residency for illegal immigrants.
And if I were a social conservative, I'd be terrified that 60% of voters in this election think that abortion should be legal for all circumstances. And that more people think same sex marriage should be recognized than not (49% to 46%). Not to mention that Wisconsin (of all places) just elected the first openly gay senator.
Things are changing the US. It wasn't just that Romney was unlikable, it wasn't just that he had to pander to the base to get elected. Over the past 8 years conservative, republican positions have become more and more untenable to the majority of voters.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
I wish people would quit using the word "insolvent" in relation to the federal debt. The United States government can print as many dollars as it wants or needs. While there are significant downsides to the U.S. printing it's way out of debt, it can be done. Thus, the U.S. is by definition not insolvent. If the United States defaults on its debt, it's because the government (or the people running the government) choose to do so.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:4, Interesting)
Secession would probably be a bad choice for Texas or any other state.
Actually, I often wonder whether the US should not look into expansion as a way to boost economic growth in the next 2 or 3 decades. Europe is a mess right now but countries like Germany reaped tremendous economic benefits from the establishment of the European Union. Even though the US is in bad shape right now, there is probably still a lot of countries in latin america that would love the opportunity to join the US. The problem is that in the past the US has only offered trade agreements like NAFTA.
I understand that the idea of expanding the US into Spanish speaking Latin America may seem like just more trouble. Think about it twice though. Just to the south of us we have Mexico. Probably most Mexicans (particularly in the North) would love to join the US. Mexico has a lot of oil and farmland. Their country is a mess...they would benefit from us coming in and putting the place in order and our economy would benefit of all the opportunities that expansion of our country would provide. Panama is another one further south that should probably be anexed to the US. Their economy has actually been thriving recently. Let's expand the USA rather than breaking it apart.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
We're ticked off at the way you've treated California and we've decided we're leaving.
We intend to form our own country and we're taking the other Blue States with us.
In case you aren't aware that includes Hawaii, Oregon, Washington, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois and all the Northeast.
We believe this split will be beneficial to the nation and especially to the people of the new country of New California.
To sum up briefly:
You get Texas, Oklahoma and all the slave states.
We get stem cell research and the best beaches.
We get Elliot Spitzer. You get Ken Lay.
We get the Statue of Liberty. You get OpryLand.
We get Intel and Microsoft. You get WorldCom.
We get Harvard. You get Ole' Miss.
We get 85 percent of America's venture capital and entrepreneurs. You get Alabama.
We get two-thirds of the tax revenue. You get to make the red states pay their fair share.
Since our aggregate divorce rate is 22 percent lower than the Christian Coalition's we get a bunch of happy families. You get a bunch of single moms.
Please be aware that Nuevo California will be pro choice and anti war and we're going to want all our citizens back from Iraq at once. If you need people to fight ask your evangelicals. They have kids they're apparently willing to send to their deaths for no purpose and they don't care if you don't show pictures of their children's caskets coming home.
We wish you success in Iraq and hope that the WMDs turn up but we're not willing to spend our resources in Bush's Quagmire.
With the Blue States in hand we will have firm control of 80% of the country's fresh water, more than 90% of the pineapple and lettuce, 92% of the nation's fresh fruit, 95% of America's quality wines (you can serve French wines at state dinners) 90% of all cheese, 90 percent of the high tech industry, most of the US low sulfur coal, all living redwoods, sequoias and condors, all the Ivy and Seven
Sister schools plus Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Cal Tech and MIT.
With the Red States you will have to cope with 88% of all obese Americans and their projected health care costs, 92% of all US mosquitoes, nearly 100% of the tornadoes, 90% of the hurricanes, 99% of all Southern Baptists, virtually 100% of all televangelists, Rush
Limbaugh, Bob Jones University, Clemson and the University of Georgia.
We get Hollywood and Yosemite, thank you.
38% of those in the Red states believe Jonah was actually swallowed by a whale, 62% believe life is sacred unless we're discussing the death penalty or gun laws, 44% say that evolution is only a theory, 53% that Saddam was involved in 9/11 and 61% of you crazy bastards believe you are people with higher morals then we lefties.
We're taking the good pot too. You can have that dirt weed they grow in Mexico.
from: http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/jokes/bljokedearredstates.htm [about.com]
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Funny)
Wait wait. I'm from Missouri. We entered the union as a slave state, but we never seceded (except the parts that tried to) and we fought on both sides of the Civil War. Our senators are one each, D and R, and we used to vote for Democratic presidents until just recently. So are we a slave state or a free state? I don't wanna get stuck with the crazies. I LIKE lettuce.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
If you pay attention to what they have been doing recently they made that choice. They are firmly going with social conservatism and spending like a sailor on shore leave. Sadly they want to do that last part and cut taxes at the same time.
Re:If there was a Bad at Math Map... (Score:5, Insightful)
| Iran has strong religious values, and gas at 50 cents a gallon and the most polluted capital city anywhere.
That is what they wish for.
Re: (Score:3)
Think of the foreign aid!
7000 more needed for a response (Score:5, Insightful)
Response:
No.
Re:7000 more needed for a response (Score:5, Insightful)
That *should* be the response, however, judging by past actions, if it gets close to the point where a response is promissed, the petition will quietly disappear.
That's what's happened in other instances where he didn't want to respond.
Re:7000 more needed for a response (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:7000 more needed for a response (Score:5, Interesting)
Here's the proper response, IMHO:
"Dear Pertitioners;
If you loved this country as much as you claim to, you would know - or would make the effort to learn - that the Executive Branch of the Federal Government has absolutely no authority to determine who is and is not a state or territory. Next time try talking to your Senators and Representatives.
Sincerely,
President Barack Obama"
Maybe it would be worded a little less snarky, but that's how I'd do it.
=Smidge=
Good luck with that. (Score:5, Funny)
I'm conflicted whether Obama's response should be:
or
Re:Good luck with that. (Score:4, Funny)
I vote for: "Please, can you take Kansas with you? Thanks. B.O."
Re: (Score:3)
Obama says that he models himself after Lincoln, so...
Re:Good luck with that. (Score:4, Funny)
As stated before, we Mexicans don't want Texas back, you can keep it.
White House Response (Score:4, Funny)
Re:White House Response (Score:5, Insightful)
Now's our chance! (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3)
Re:Now's our chance! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Now's our chance! (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm not signing, out of respect for the 41.4% of Texans who voted for Obama and the fraction of the 57.2% who voted for Romney who aren't loudmouthed fatheads. Together they surely form a majority of Texas voters.
The likely response: (Score:5, Insightful)
Blow it out your ass. We survived Bush, you can survive Obama. Grow the fuck up.
Re:The likely response: (Score:5, Interesting)
Many people survived neither Bush nor Obama.
Re:The likely response: (Score:5, Funny)
I think Presidents should automatically get added to the list of hurricane names.
Let them go. (Score:5, Insightful)
Being a resident of New England, I'm tired of paying for their highways and such while they accuse us here as being Un-American.
For fucks sake. Leave already.
What I found especially amusing was the tea-tard messages claiming people would high-tail it to Canada if Obama got re-elected. Yeah, the country next door with single-payer health insurance, decent social security, more gun regulation, etc.
Go. Go to Canada.
--
BMO
Re:Let them go. (Score:5, Funny)
"I'm moving to Australia, because their president is a Christian and actually supports what he says."
"And it's right next door to Switzerland."
Re:Let them go. (Score:4, Funny)
"And it's right next door to Switzerland."
You mean Sweden, right? People are always mixing those two up.
Re:Let them go. (Score:5, Funny)
The Texas one is now over the threshold (Score:5, Insightful)
29,025 and presumably climbing. I say, great. Good riddance.
The return the Confederacy? (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm not American, but it seems to me that there is a growing geographical dichotomy between the left leaning states and the right leaning states. Some of the old confederate states esp. Texas seem to be moving more and more to the right as the coastal states seem to be moving more to the left.
The left states seem to be moving closer to the Europe and the rest of the world in terms of politics. That is being less religious, pro-choice, pro-gay, anti-war, pro-environment, etc. While the right leaning states seem to be rallying around the Church.
While I realize it is not a possibility anytime soon, but in 100 years could we see the return of the Confederate States of America?
Re:The return the Confederacy? (Score:4, Informative)
While I realize it is not a possibility anytime soon, but in 100 years could we see the return of the Confederate States of America?
They'll have to pick a different capital - they lost Virginia, by virtue of it being too close to the Capitol. Or they could just split it up like last time. And they'd better hurry before whites are a minority in Texas. Currently they are only 52% of the population, and Hispanics make up something like 90% of the population growth in the state.
I think Republicans are going to either change tactics, or become a permanent minority party.
Re:The return the Confederacy? (Score:5, Informative)
And if you look at a county map, you will almost certainly see the CITIES.
Time to update the urban archipelago maps. [urbanarchipelago.com] I bet they still hold.
Re:The return the Confederacy? (Score:4, Informative)
Fact: In this election, young people (18-29) cast more votes than old people (65+) for the first time ever; and they vastly prefer Dems positions on social issues (immigration, health care, women's rights, gay marriage, etc.). Demographics say this will only increase in the future -- http://news.yahoo.com/gop-faces-steep-climb-young-voters-080006202--politics.html [yahoo.com]
That's not everything, not a panacea for all our problems, but saying "the entire country has been moving to the right" just doesn't seem generally valid.
Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Wrong Branch (Score:4)
succession = racism? (Score:5, Insightful)
A fundamental disagreement with the government policies does not automatically equal racism but of course you are free to perpetuate that myth...
Race card (Score:3, Insightful)
Derp is derp, and insinuating that people who don't like Obama must be racist is a mindless of a cliche of derp as derp gets. Divisive language like that used by the story submitter is a perfect example of how /not/ to bring the country back together after a nasty presidential election.
A trade? (Score:5, Funny)
As a Louisiana Resident. (Score:4, Interesting)
The country is terminally divided. (Score:3)
Whichever side you agree with, you think the other 50% of the country are wrong.
They're not going to change their views.
We have no way to go forward. Bipartisanship is a joke; liberals like methodology, conservatives like results. There is no compatibility.
Further, the liberal side is mostly women, minorities, homosexuals/transgenders and college students. The conservative side is mostly white men.
It's time to either beat down one side, or divide up the country so we all get what we want.
1861's (and 1776's) solution was states' rights.
Wonder what we'll pick, and how bad the ensuing war will be.
Re:The country is terminally divided. (Score:5, Interesting)
It's not about states. It's about cities. [urbanarchipelago.com]
sexism at its finest (Score:4, Interesting)
Further, the liberal side is mostly women, minorities, homosexuals/transgenders and college students. The conservative side is mostly white men.
No, actually. A solid majority of white women voted for Romney. Also, while virtually nobody black voted for Romney, a very large number of other non-white citizens did - each category, it was around 1/3rd.
http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/johncassidy/2012/11/why-white-women-voted-for-romney.html [newyorker.com]
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/elections/2012-exit-poll [foxnews.com]
That's a pretty feeble stab at the race card (Score:5, Insightful)
I think the idea of secession is an absurdity, and to suggest it immediately marks one whose political input is meaningless.
Nevertheless, the summary's implication secessionist talk as racist is equally weaksauce.
To suggest that only racists would react to an overweening Federal government that cheerfully violates any inconvenient statute without hesitation, one which has run roughshod over the clearly-stated limits to Federal power set forth in the US Constitution, and whose constituent elements have both ignored their actual duties (budget? Who bothers with a budget?) and colluded to deliberately circumvent the system of checks and balances set out by the founding fathers (War Powers Act? Who needs such a thing?) is suggesting really that white people are somehow the only one capable of recognizing the disastrous course our country has been on for at least 60 years, and that's fairly patronizing if not outright racist itself.
Oh, Please. This Happens EVERY Election (Score:5, Insightful)
Good news for the secessionists.... (Score:4, Funny)
Reasonably capable general is on the market :-)
Excellent summation of how this would go... (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:3)
I realise there's probably an xkcd for this, but floods and "several" seem to be two different extremes to me.
Obligatory XKCD [xkcd.com]
Re:Bad at Everything (Score:5, Funny)
You've got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know... morons.
Re:first post (Score:4, Funny)
He seceded from the main thread.
Re:Is this news? (Score:4, Informative)
This is an argument that I absolutely despise. "X isn't as important as Y, so don't bother me until Y^2 happens."
You do realize that it only takes one serious whackadoo to take some pop-shots at the presidential cavalcade to make the direction of the world change, correct? Further, do you realize that this funny little petition is the top-side of some real, and very confusing, anger in the country?
Stop being a negative douche. By the time that something like this gets to the governor or state legislature, some "random retard" will have already taken the wind out of their sails by blowing something/someone up.
In other words - stupid things are generally the leading edge of something more serious.
Re:Something not adding up... (Score:5, Funny)
Although personally, I think it'd be about the best thing in the world if the USA were to split apart into North half/South half or something, since OBVIOUSLY this country has some severe agreement issues, and always has ever since the first days of the USA.
We could call the countries North America and South America. Then we'd have a North America in North America and a South America in North America, but neither a North America nor a South America in South America.
And I thought the whole Washington/Washington DC thing was unnecessarily confusing.
Re:Good Idea (Score:5, Insightful)
Anyone with half a brain I know of didn't vote.
I didn't vote, and none of my friends voted.
Well if you had more than half a brain, you would have voted. It is your only power to prevent the things you do not like in politics.
This two party system is only going to bring more welfare, poverty and despair and finally a dictatorship to control it all just like North Korea.
While I do not see the dictatorship aspect, a two party system is one of our biggest problems... However, you did nothing to stop it, even an AC that replied to you earlier realizes that if a 3rd party gets 5% of the vote, they qualify for federal election funding in the next race. That is the first step to get rid of the two party system.
Nobody is doing nothing about the banks robbing everything, billions go missing and nobody goes to jail.
It is out of control, and it is all going to end very badly.
Yet, in spite of this, you still sit home and do not vote. You do absolutely nothing to help yourself and everyone else. You let the corrupt incumbents stay in office instead of attempting to vote them out. All it takes is for our elected officials to actually fear for their job to get them to listen to the people; right now they only listen to the people who finance their campaigns... If they get voted out, or narrowly squeeze by, they will be more likely to listen to the people the next time.
One thing that the Obama campaign proved this year, is that it is people turning out to vote that will get you elected, not getting more campaign contributions. (Of course, trying to get them to realize that themselves will be difficult at best base on the number of "give me more money" emails they sent out this year.)
In short, by staying home, you are part of the problem. A smart person realizes that the right to vote is valuable and will exercise that right whenever he/she can.
Re:Good Idea (Score:5, Insightful)
Then shut the fuck up.