Patriot Act Clouds Picture For Tech 203
Harperdog writes "Politico has a piece on how the Patriot Act is interfering with U.S. firms trying to do business overseas in the area of cloud computing. Here's a quote: 'The Sept. 11-era law was supposed to help the intelligence community gather data on suspected terrorists. But competitors overseas are using it as a way to discourage foreign countries from signing on with U.S. cloud computing providers like Google and Microsoft: Put your data on a U.S.-based cloud, they warn, and you may just put it in the hands of the U.S. government.'"
Probably, but... (Score:5, Insightful)
Yep (Score:5, Insightful)
Doesn't matter if you comply with EU data protection rules, we still don't trust you.
A new way? (Score:4, Insightful)
Well why not? (Score:4, Insightful)
Friends,
I don't understand these companies' hesitance when deciding to do business with US-based companies. Sure, the data may need to be seen by the government, but we aren't China; the data will be kept safe while our researchers are doing God's work by looking for pedophiles, rapists, and terrorists. Perhaps they could even insert biblical references into the cloud, in order to spread the Word to those who would not otherwise hear it.
Your Friend,
Jake
Goes both ways (Score:5, Insightful)
'Warn' ? (Score:5, Insightful)
Who can blame them? (Score:5, Insightful)
Four thoughts:
They may well be right in thinking their data will be more accessible to the US government.
If I were an overseas competitor, I'd certainly use this as a reason to not to use a US provider. In a heartbeat.
The law of unintended consequences bites the US yet again.
This wouldn't be an issue if the US government hadn't acted the way it has over the last 10 years. The US government has so little trust overseas that people have no trouble thinking the worst of it. Karma is a bitch.
As a European (Score:3, Insightful)
But competitors overseas are using it as a way to discourage foreign countries from signing on with U.S. cloud computing providers like Google and Microsoft
It's not just competitors highlighting that important fact! As a European, I personally don't want my data to fall into the wrong hands, and the hands of the US corporation-state are most definitely wrong.
We're MUCH safer then the other guy... TRUST us... (Score:4, Insightful)
Salesman: "That's right, since we don't operate within the borders of those capitalist pig Americans, we're way more trustworthy then them... We absolutely promise that we'll never give away your data to the US government, no matter how many times they ask us. ............... Wait... what just happened?
Customer: That's great... but what about your own government? Do you ever give data up to them?
Salesman: Huh? Well, of course not! At least, not without a court order, anyway... or a law which says we have to for some reason.
Customer: Ah... So how is that different from the US based companies again?
Salesman: Ummm... but... capitalist pigs... ummm...
Customer: I see. Well, this has been very illuminating indeed. I'll get back to you on my decision real soon.
Salesman:
Re:what's the problem? (Score:3, Insightful)
You don't mind me having a look around your house, do you? Oh, don't bother letting your wife know that we're going to be in - wouldn't want to bother her or anything. What? You don't want strangers poking around? What are you hiding?
Re:what's the problem? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Yep (Score:5, Insightful)
Would you kindly step up the enforcement, then? We all know that the US government isn't going to listen to it's citizens, but it's just as obvious that they listen to corporations. Maybe if Amazon, Google and a few other major cloud storage providers take a huge hit, they'll tell the government to fix the situation.
No kidding (Score:4, Insightful)
This seems like trying to spin a general fact of life in terms of "the cloud" (a term I dislike) in to an anti-US thing.
Your data is subject to being looked at by whoever controls it. Doesn't matter if they are supposed to, they can. The idea that the US government is the only one that looks in on data in their country is quite silly.
Also to expand on your bribery note, this could well be done by the government too in any country, but not as direct bribery: Find an employee who is patriotic to your country at the service, recruit them, and use them to get access to data you want. Could be quite easy since even a very moral person might agree. The government sells them on the idea that they need this access for legit work and it is just much quicker and cheaper to do it back channel rather than via the courts.
Basically if you give up your data to someone else, you have to understand that means others can have access. That is going to include their government. Don't think this is unique to the US. Other countries participate in the intelligence game just as much. Look up some information on the British Security Service or Secret Intelligence Service, or the French DGSE.
Re:what's the problem? (Score:5, Insightful)
The fascists rely on the Just World fallacy to back up their arguments.
The world is just. Shit happens to you because you did something wrong.
It's a load of horse-shit.
--
BMO
Re:Who can blame them? (Score:2, Insightful)
Obama's done right and wrong and isn't a saint by a long shot, however it's going to take time to undo the damage bush caused, him leaving office does not immediately end wars and fix global depressions.
Re:Well why not? (Score:5, Insightful)
It's not anti-theist, it's anti USA-theism. Europe has plenty of Christians, after all, as do many other parts of the world, but Christianity as it's practiced in the USA is a very weird and disturbing mix of fundamentalist religion and politics. After all, you can go into any typical American "evangelical Christian" (aka fundamentalist) church and they'll preach about how the USA needs to wage wars in various countries, how you (the congregation) needs to vote for these particular politicians, how we need to worship The Invisible Hand, how rich people are better people than the rest of us because God has blessed them with so much money and "success", etc. Now obviously, not all Christians in America believe this crap, but the numbers of fundies has actually outgrown the number of "mainstream" Protestants in the USA, and they are a very strong political force (esp. since they are so politically involved, unlike most other religions). This of course is completely different from the types of Christianity practiced in Europe for example, where fundamentalism is almost non-existent.