No iPhone Apps, Please — We're British

GMGruman writes "The BBC has stirred up quite a row in Britain about a shocking use of taxpayer funds: creating iPhone apps to provide citizens services. As InfoWorld blogger Galen Gruman notes, it's apparently bad in Britain for the government to use modern technology during a recession, a mentality he likens as a shift from 'cool Britannia' to 'fool Britannia.'"

Re:Maybe something everybody can use?

[Gordonjcp]

Not to mention that the apps don't seem terribly useful. Have a look at the original BBC article - to quote, "The most expensive application was a proposed Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (DVLA) app that provides "a masterclass for changing your wheel"." and then goes on to explain how it can act as a hazard warning light, calculate fuel consumption and track RAC patrols. So, right there you've got an app costing (apparently) £40,000 to develop, that only runs on a single, expensive platform and is only of use to RAC members who don't know how to change a wheel. Waitaminute. [bbc.co.uk]

Firstly, if you passed your test in the UK in the past five years then knowing how to change a wheel is actually part of the test. You don't have to actually do it on the test, you just have to demonstrate that you know how - so if, for example, you're disabled you could ask someone to help and tell them what to do. Furthermore, if you don't know how to change a wheel, *and* you have RAC cover, then you could just phone the RAC and within half an hour or so a guy in a big orange van will be along and change it for you.

That forty grand could be spent on far more useful things.

HTML5?

[exomondo]

With the capabilities of HTML5 you'd think they'd do webapps instead of platform-specific ones.

Re:iphone

[Spad]

BBC != British Government.

Re:iphone

[gdshaw]

a) The BBC doesn't receive taxpayer pounds

Incorrect: the BBC is primarily funded by a tax on the use of television sets.

(Yes, you can avoid this tax by not owning a television, in much the same way as you can avoid income tax by not working or VAT by not shopping. It is not merely a subscription fee for watching BBC content, as it is payable regardless of which channels you watch. You can argue about whether this is a good thing or a bad thing, but to claim that they are not funded by taxes is wrong for any reasonable definition of the word 'tax'.)

Re:Proprietary formats

[Spad]

The summary is fucking awful. This isn't about the BBC *at all*, they're the ones reporting the story about the *Government* wasting money on largely worthless iPhone apps rather than focusing on useful, cross platform ones.

Re:Maybe something everybody can use?

[BasilBrush]

Er, no! Symbian only has a 2% market share and falling.

The link you give refers to some form of US only survey. They don't make it clear, other than using the word "National" rather than "International".

The article is talking about the UK, and last time I looked that is not one of the US states.

Worldwide, Symbian is still the market leader, with 44.3% of the market. The nearest competitor is RIM with 19.4%.
http://www.gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=1372013 [gartner.com]

Re:Maybe something everybody can use?

[BasilBrush]

Given that you don't live in the UK, it's not your government, and it's not your tax money. So spare us the pleas.

The dumb article has it wrong. It's not an app for "motorcyclists", it's an app for "motorists". Motorcyclists don't "change their wheel" by the roadside, they don't carry a spare. A few might carry a spare innertube. But that's not what this app is about.

Reading between he lines the app appears to be one to encourage people to update their details with the DVLA - who are in charge of road tax and licensing. In order to encourage people to download it, it has some motoring utilities, such as the ones mentioned.

What we have here is a chain of misinformation that goes TPA -> BBC -> Galen Gruman -> "GM" Gruman -> Slashdot. The TPA is "The Tax Payers Alliance", which is a right wing lobby group against pretty much any government spending, that routinely twists the truth in press releases, and is responsible as a result for a lot of misinformation in UK news channels. So a rocky start, but at each step of the way, the message has become more twisted still.

Re:Maybe something everybody can use?

[Manip]

Changing a tire is not part of the UK driving test as it stands. You do have to know how to check the tire for damage, check the oil, and water levels.

Also saying "change the wheel" doesn't mean what you think it means....

Re:iphone

[jewelie]

Good point, so we should berate them for setting up all the Gov websites too, as not everyone has access to the internet,

Which is exactly why libraries here provide access to computers and the internet. (And yes, they're normally well used!)

and obviously any new road building must be shelved until we can ensure everyone has a car!

Excluding motorways (for which I might agree with you) public highways are for bikes and pedestrians and buses and other transport, not just cars.

Re:Supporting citizens vs supporting a platform

[Mr Reaney]

The license fee (which I support) funds all of BBC content that is not funded by the arms of the BBC which make profit (BBC worldwide, for example). The basis is generally, around the British Isles, you can obtain BBC broadcast & interactive services free of charge at the point of use. British subjects (which includes IOM & CI residents) pay a license fee in order to be permitted to use equipment that is capable of receiving television broadcasts. This is compulsory, whether or not they use that equipment to receive or view BBC content, or indeed any broadcast content. No difference if they receive the signal through terrestrial broadcast, satellite broadcast or cable, and even if you pay a subscription to the provider of the broadcast, you still pay a license fee. There is no veriation between analogue, standard digital or HD services, but I think you can get a discounted license if your TV is monochrome (black & white for those of us who had one once!) The fee is charged for use of TV kit, but funds TV, radio, web/interactive, Ceefax and many public services run by the BBC. It is perfectly legitimate to complain about spending on iPhone apps rather than web apps - as legitimate to complain about 6Music and the Asian network (DAB-only BBC radio stations) However, that's what the BBC trust is about... I think the phrase might be "there are other closed-access mobile application stores available" Now, if the rest of the world can understand the issues at stake when many license fee payers seem unaware, fine. I suspect though, that TFA's author doesn't understand them as I see them. for what it's worth, I love the BBC, despite 90% being a bit crap. I support the license fee, but would like it to be lower. I'd like 6Music on FM, I won't get DAB for my car! BBC1 is a bit crap, and regional BBC radio/TV for my area is rubbish and NEVER GET THE WEATHER RIGHT! but to abolish or curtail the BBC would be a disaster for the whole world. The freedom from advertising alone is worth £120/year and I would never listen to commercial radio, even if they abolished the BBC. A few hundred grand on iphone app development does not overly bother me.

Re:Maybe something everybody can use?

[tehcyder]

Uh, you have to know how to change tires to pass the test? Why in God's name is that a test point? It's certainly not relevant to safe driving. I have had 1 flat tire in 35+ years. I certainly know how to change them (changed many a tire on race cars), but I would wager that most people would call the auto club.

The UK has sensibly decided to include this, as well as questions about routine maintenance in the driving test. It means that fewer people will drive around in dangerous vehicles simply because they don't know how to check the oil level or tyre pressure.

Re:Maybe something everybody can use?

[qc_dk]

Um, what? I, too, live in Scandinavia, and it takes about $20 to change your tires in a repair shop - less than that if you use one of those temporary changing places that pop up at spring and fall.

Not here.

Also, the only Scandinavian country where tax rate even goes to 60% is Denmark

You Sir, have won some herring.

and even there it tops at 62.28%, which would require you to be a top earner - according to Wikipedia [wikipedia.org], even the equivalent of $138,000 wouldn't hit even 50%, much less 60%. Which means there's no way in Hell you'd have to work for two days for a net gain of $100.

Care to explain?

I most certainly would care. You are confounding average tax and marginal tax. Once I have hit an income of 59000 dollars(I'm just about there) a year I pay 60% tax on everything earned beyond that. So if I have to have a net gain of 100$ I would have to earn 250$. I earn about 160$ a day. So I would have to work ~1.6 days more, not taking travel costs and extra expenses into account. Not so far from two days I would say.

Bonus info: about 1/3 of all working Danes are earning enough to hit the top percentage.