Anonymous Blogger Outed By Politician 300
Snoskred writes with the story of a blogger who chose to remain pseudonymous, who has been outed by an Alaskan politician in his legislative newsletter. Alaska Rep. Mike Doogan had been writing bizarre emails to people who emailed him, and the Alaskan blogger "Mudflats" was one of those who called him on it. (Mudflats first began getting noticed after blogging about Sarah Palin from a local point of view.) Doogan seems to have developed a particular itch to learn who Mudflats is, and he finally found out, though he got her last name wrong, and named her in his official newsletter. The Huffington Post is one of the many outlets writing about the affair. The blogger happens to be Democrat — as is Doogan — but that is immaterial to the question of the right to anonymity in political speech. Does an American have the right to post political opinion online anonymously? May a government official breach that anonymity absent a compelling state interest?
Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
Does an American have the right to post political opinion online anonymously?
Sure.
May a government official breach that anonymity absent a compelling state interest?
Why yes. Everyone has the right to keep their identity a secret.. but no-one has the right to prevent others from discovering their secrets.
Uhm... (Score:1, Insightful)
I don't recall ever seeing anything about a RIGHT to anonymity? This isn't healthcare.
You want to blog and take potshots at someone, don't be surprised if they try to find out who you are.
Anonomity should not be required (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Anonomity should not be required (Score:5, Insightful)
I'd guess that it isn't the politicians that one would be worried about.
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
but no-one has the right to prevent others from discovering their secrets.
So does you proclamation apply to whisle blowers, people in witness protection, confidential documents, your SSN, trade secrets, etc.
People have a perfect right to protect their secrets, otherwise they wouldn't be secrets.
This is kind of stupid. (Score:4, Insightful)
Anonymity (Score:4, Insightful)
ahem (Score:4, Insightful)
Does an American have the right to post political opinion online anonymously?
Yes. And anywhere else for that matter.
May a government official breach that anonymity absent a compelling state interest?
No. See The Constitutional Amendment #1. Yes, that old thing is still kicking around these days.
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually, that is not the case. Government officials in particular have a greater duty to protect your privacy than the average citizen, due to their access to greater-than-normal tools to violate it.
If, for example, Rep. Doogan abused his office to discover Mudflat's identity, then that would be a serious problem.
A what? (Score:5, Insightful)
Just exactly who is going to decide what "... a compelling state interest" is?
Let me guess? The same people that will charge you with treason or terrorism?
Yes, I think anonymous speech should be protected... until it become defamation or slander. Both are pretty difficult slopes to tread when the figure being defamed or slandered is a public figure. On another note, a political figure is both public and a part of the government. They have even less right to any privacy regarding their lives than probably anyone else. Despite the allure of any resulting tapes, Pamela Anderson has a right to expect privacy... no matter who she is fucking. A political leader... not so much.
Of course they have 'the right'... (Score:5, Insightful)
Of course they have 'the right' to protect their secrets - as in this case, their identity. However, do they have a legal leg to stand on in trying to fight somebody who has made that secret public? I'd say they don't.
So, yes, anybody - politician or otherwise - should be perfectly allowed to blow somebody's 'anonymity' if there was no agreement between the two parties to maintain that anonymity (as in some court proceedings, witness protection program, etc. etc.).
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
Except he's a public official. I for one very much doubt he did this in his own time, or with his own money.
The blogger committed no crime, as from TFA. So what gives?
Hate to state the obvious, but that strikes me as a personal vendetta being pursued while the fine representative should be more concerned with matters of public interest.
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Anonomity should not be required (Score:5, Insightful)
Not directly, but indirectly.
Fear of saying what you want to because you might get fired, but why would the company have any reason to fear it's employees opinions unless the company could be harassed by politic(ian)s.
Same goes for the FBI, IRS and the rest of bullshit organizations, someone speaks out about what they think, and somehow that gives the FBI, or IRS the right to arbitrarily investigate you, the police to follow you, why?
The government is there to serve the people, the people aren't there to serve the government.
Story immaterial to "right" to anonymity (Score:2, Insightful)
In conclusion, this story tells us that Rep. Mike Doogan is a paranoid whiner who thinks that the internet is Serious Business. There is a right to be free of unreasonable search and seizure, and a right to freedom of the press, but if anyone thinks that there a right to publish anonymously, even in the face of a breech of said anonymity using public information, that person is the one who lacks an understanding of the first amendment. Indeed, the (obsessive, childish, etc.) State Representative (i.e. The Man) is fully exercising his first amendment right to freedom of speech in this case. It would be a dark day indeed if Rep. Mike Doogan needed a state interest, compelling or otherwise, to whine in emails about bloggers being mean to him on the interwebs.
Re:ahem (Score:4, Insightful)
Rather than simple assertions and "that old thing" wisecracks, perhaps you should explain how the right to free speech means that, in this case, Doogan has no right to free speech?
Re:Uhhh (Score:0, Insightful)
This would be a Non-Story if the parties where reversed, Mike Doogan being a Dem. and Mudflats being a Republican bashing Obama. And I think most people know it.
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
Except he's a public official. I for one very much doubt he did this in his own time, or with his own money.
But you're turning this around. Again, that's a question of abuse of power, which really has nothing to do with protection of privacy. Politicians can and do abuse their power in any number of ways to get what they want. Whether that happened here is a separate issue.
The question is "do you have a right to anonymity when making political editorials?" That's a different question than "do you have the right to make anonymous political editorials?" The answer to the latter question is "of course". The answer to the former question is "of course not".
There's no protection of privacy when making editorials, especially ones that by design are intended to hurt someone else. Whether or not that hurt is justified and the editorial truthful is immaterial - just as an accused defendant has the right to know his accuser in court, so too is it elsewhere in our society.
Look at it this way. Imagine if, instead of some random person, this blogger was instead a member of the Republican National Committee executing a covert strategy to take down this Democratic representative. Would their privacy be protected then? If not, why not?
There can't be a double standard for the obvious reason that you don't know who you're dealing with or what their motives are until they are unmasked. And both the accused and the public have a right to know that.
Anonymity has its uses, but this country has a much longer history - and a long legal basis - in people dealing with each other face to face, with all the cards on the table.
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
I cant't cite any state laws but the U.S. Supreme Court has repeatedly upheld the right to anonymous speech as part of the right to free speech.
Re:It depends.... (Score:5, Insightful)
"Outing" the blogger disclosed some of the biases in her accusations.
Dude, we knew more about her biases from what she wrote in her blog than from knowing her real name.
"Mudflats" biases were on worn on her virtual sleeve, not hidden behind her pseudonym.
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
Yup, but the supreme court has never said "you can't try to find out who that anonymous person is".. if you want to remain anonymous it's your responsibility to protect your identity.. you have no legal right to that. You can't contact the police and say "hey, someone is trying to find out who I am, stop them!"
Re:Of course they have 'the right'... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Anonomity should not be required (Score:3, Insightful)
Mhmm, thats why I said "...unless the company could be harassed by politic(ian)s "
But even still, the politics of that company, are probably that way because they are sucking up to a politician/political party for less taxes, more this, less that, whatever...
Although, if your politics differ that strongly from your employer, then you are sort of trapped into mental slavery if you continue to work there. I've left some, and got intentionally fired from a few jobs for that reason because to me it's like, fighting for the Nazi's when you don't believe in their concepts, to what end?
Pretty much the same for business-to-business, you either leave politics out of it (unless it directly deals in it) or don't deal with businesses that contradict your businesses politics. I know that's somewhat black & white, and not "economically viable" and all that, but that's only because they continue to keep it in the gray and have stuff like one company behind 2 parties in a war etc, which is political in one aspect, but monetary in the other, but that's only a different kind of politics.
Re:Anonomity should not be required (Score:5, Insightful)
I can see where you're coming from, and it is a concern. However, we can only hope that most rational people will be able to see ad hominem attacks for what they are and filter them out from any real differing points of view.
If people were good at filtering out ad hominem attacks, then people wouldn't use ad hominem attacks, because they wouldn't work.
Unfortunately, people are idiots, ad hominem attacks do work, and "Think of the children! Why do you hate children? Are you a pedophile?" frequently does more to discount your argument to a crowd than any logical, well debated argument.
Re:This is kind of stupid. (Score:3, Insightful)
He discovered her identity fair and square. Would you propose that one must pretend not to know who someone behind a publication is based on some arbitrary set of circumstances. "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" and whatnot.
That's not the issue. What's being questioned here is what purpose is served by sharing that knowledge with a few thousand of his closest friends via his political mailing list.
It's not so much that he's broken any laws that sticks on my craw, it's the fact that he felt it necessary to expose a critic (from within his own party, no less) to ad hominem attack. He could have engaged constructively with the ideas themselves, but instead he felt it necessary to spend all his time and effort simply putting a name to the words.
As an ex-journalist, Doogan should have shown a little more respect to the long history in the US of anonymous political speech, dating from the Federalist Papers. Disagree with what they're saying? No problem; let's engage on the ideas. I can respect that.
But when he spends all his time and effort publicly identifying and attacking the person, Doogan loses whatever respect I might have been willing to give him.
What he's done is not necessarily illegal. It's just petty and disrespectful.
Re:What right was infringed? (Score:5, Insightful)
Congratulations, you've so enshrined the Constitution so as to invite the very tyranny that was fought over two centuries ago. Anonymous speech is crucial to voicing intelligent opinion unfavorable to the powers that be. So much so, that the very people who built the Constitution you cherish dared not publish the Federal Papers under their actual names. Somehow, the entire nation has read the 9th amendment and looked the other way.
Well played, sir.
Freedom of speech != Right to anonymity (Score:4, Insightful)
I expect most /.ers to disagree with me, but I think it is worth keeping in mind that freedom of speech is not only not the same as a guaranteed right to speak anonymously, but it is actually intended to make anonymity irrelevant - at least when it comes to speaking your opinion about important issues of politicas, faith etc. - by giving legal protection from any persecution from the state. It is a very specific right, not meant to be a cover-all that gives anybody the right to say anything, however acrimonious, or spread rumours and snipe at people from a safe cover.
That aside - I don't know the specifics of this story. To me it seems obvious that if you have some important viewpoints and observations, you have the right to speak out about it in public and should have the courage to show your face - if you hide behind anonymity, you appear less credible, as if you are ashamed of yourself or you know that what you have to say is bullshit.
As far as I am concerned, it may be permissible to allow anonymity in some cases to protect those who might otherwise suffer unjust retaliation - eg. if they are whistleblowers, or particularly vulnerable witnesses in court - but I think it has to be limited to when there is a special need to show extra concern. I don't think this generally apllies to bloggers.
Now, go on, hate me forever and all that.
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
Fourth Amendment reads:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
That does NOT say you are guaranteed to privacy outside your house, or that the government can't snoop through your activities... That means that unless there are laws in existence governing the type of circumstance AC found herself in, the government can do what it pleases and be legal.
Now, I personally think that the right to privacy implicitly exists in the constitution (our president shares this view), but many folks think this type of thing is just a guaranteed right to us as citizens... it's not.
Wrong! (Score:2, Insightful)
The question is "do you have a right to anonymity when making political editorials?" That's a different question than "do you have the right to make anonymous political editorials?" The answer to the latter question is "of course". The answer to the former question is "of course not".
Horseshit [wikipedia.org]. The Bill of Rights exists because of anonymous free speech. Also, the Supreme Court has a long history of protecting anonymous free speech. You [eff.org] are [eff.org] entirely [ca.gov] wrong [cornell.edu] in every [epic.org] point [nytimes.com] you make.
The right to anonymous speech is enshrined in the highest law of the land. Whether or not the statements are hurtful is irrelevant. Your political example is particularly clueless.
Protections for anonymous speech are vital to democratic discourse. Allowing dissenters to shield their identities frees them to express critical, minority views . . . Anonymity is a shield from the tyranny of the majority. . . . It thus exemplifies the purpose behind the Bill of Rights, and of the First Amendment in particular: to protect unpopular individuals from retaliation . . . at the hand of an intolerant society.
The parent poster is correct in framing this as a possible abuse of power. It is probably not illegal to reveal someone's identity. It can be illegal to use political power to discover someone's identity.
Your homework assignment (i.e. if you want to debate this without looking like a total idiot) is to prepare an argument against internet anonymity with reference to libel and slander. The links I provided should give you plenty of ammunition. Also, if you dig back through slashdot, there was a recent case in the maryland supreme court (IIRC) involving a fast food franchise trying to subpoena the identities of some critics on the internet, which may or may not have been covered in one of my links. Do note that such an argument is not relevant to the facts of TFA.
Re:What right was infringed? (Score:5, Insightful)
The Constitution is not a list of every right that ever existed or ever will. It's a document detailing what limited rights the people/states have given to the federal government; then to be extra clear, specifically mentions that the feds are not allowed to do certain things (Bill of Rights).
Let me repeat that: It's a list of rights that we give to the federal government, plus some specific restrictions on the feds. Not a list of *our* rights.
The Constitution doesn't give us a right to privacy or anything else - it doesn't grant rights, only recognizes some of them and specifically tells the federal government not to infringe those rights. It also says that not all rights are listed, but they still exist.
We have our rights by being born, both those specifically recognized in the Constitution and those not (like privacy).
When people talk about constitutional rights, they would be more correct to say "constitutionally-recognized rights".
You have the right to pursue these things, yes. They are not provided by the government, nor does current law say it should, so.. we don't.
Whether or not they should be provided by the federal government is debated. If the people want these things, the laws can be changed to support it (including a Constitutional amendment if required).
Re:Anonomity should not be required (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Uhhh (Score:5, Insightful)
There is no constitutional right to privacy.
Amendment IX - "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."
It's the ignorance of folks like you that opponents of the Bill of Rights were afraid of. They feared people would think the Bill of Rights was an exhaustive list of our rights, even if one of them explicitly stated it wasn't (i.e. the 9th). The US Constitution protects all rights, even ones not explicitly enumerated therein. The Bill of Rights was essentially a "Top 10 List" they felt were especially important. If the Supreme Court says that the right to privacy is a basic right, they don't have to justify it as an extension of the 4th. They originally did (which I think was a mistake) but they really needed only cite the 9th.
Re:Anonomity should not be required (Score:3, Insightful)
So he has to prove himself innocent to satisfy you why?
Odd how many people throw around legal this and that and suddenly think *they* are in the position to demand proof from others on any subject. Sorry, unless this guy is caught red-handed he doesn't have to prove anything to you nor anyone else. How would you feel if the feds burst into your home tonight and told you that you had to prove yourself innocent of any number of charges simply because "someone" out there thought you were guilty of some wrong doing?
Depends (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Uhhh (Score:3, Insightful)
Threats of physical violence, libel, incitement to violence, and speech which presents a "clear and present danger" (the example most commonly used is of shouting 'FIRE!' in a crowded theatre) are about the only examples of unprotected free speech in the US.
Things like "hate speech" laws, holocaust denial laws, and other backwards anti-liberty, anti-speech laws haven't quite made it here yet, but they're probably coming at some point.
Re:Uhhh (Score:3, Insightful)
At least someone else besides me has read the US Constitution without wearing Blinders of Idiocy +3.
The troubling thing is that it'd be tough to put down on paper what the Constitution does in any more simple language. I find that troubling because if it takes so little time to completely distort the meaning of such simple words even in the face of so much supporting information on the meaning of those words (Federalist Papers, etc), then what can any of us do to preserve liberty over any length of time?
Re:Uhhh (Score:3, Insightful)
First, the Bill of Rights is part of the Constitution. Please don't speak as if they were separate things.
Mostly true. They are the first ten amendments to The Constitution. In other words, these are things that were added to it. Yes, it is NOW part of the Constitution, but was not part of the original.
In other words, the list of federal powers listed in the Constitution is a limit on them...
Exactly! The Bill Of Rights is there to place a limit on federal powers. In this case, "Congress shall make no law... abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press;" The first five words in that is a direct limit on federal powers, by definition.
Anonymity is not protected in the Bill of Rights. However, as you pointed out, the Establishment Clause states that just because something is not directly listed does not mean that it is not a right. It's up to the courts and congress to decide if anonymity is protected or not. Also, this may be a state issue and since "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution... are reserved to the States respectively...", Alaska may be in its right here if the Feds don't find that anonymity should be protected.
Re:Uhhh (Score:3, Insightful)
If the Supreme Court says that the right to privacy is a basic right, they don't have to justify it as an extension of the 4th.
Let's say that there's a "right to privacy" that is protected by the 9th (I neither agree nor disagree with this assertion, because it's fairly vague).
What does a "right" mean in the context of the Constitution? It's some limitation on the power of the federal government (and in many cases the state governments, as well). It may be that they can't punish you for something (free speech, keeping a firearm), or that they cannot do something (unreasonable search, cruel punishment).
So how would such a right to privacy actually function? Surely a constitutional right does not limit the power of a citizen; that's what laws are for. And the representative is a citizen. So as long as the representative did not use powers granted to him by the federal government in order to breach the privacy, it's perfectly allowable.
Re:Of course they have 'the right'... (Score:3, Insightful)
So it's alright to out CIA agents and such who have different political views than those in power?
This is just plain abuse of power and privilege and the Congressman should at the very least be censored if not taken out of his post.
If the person was committing a libelous or slanderous act, then yes. But as a government official a third party should be called in to determine if the action was or is such an act and then pursue finding them.
For a member of government to do such a thing is crossing the bounds of the intent of the Constitution (The Human Rights Amendments).
He should be whacked upside the head with a baseball bat.
When it comes to individuals or ordinary citizens, then it becomes a different matter. But in either case, a third party (preferably judicial) should be called in to mediate, whether the actions are libelous and/or slanderous or that the person needs to be contacted to prove that the actions are not libelous or slanderous.
I think that the later case would give pause, because if the action was not found to be libelous or slanderous, then basically it is confirming that the blogger/anonymous person is telling the truth.
I would suggest that everyone write him a non-anonymous email and ask him to resign. Especially Democrats.
I did. Democrat Texas
Re:Uhhh (Score:2, Insightful)
To pursue finding someones anonymous identity may require breaking laws. If a law is broken (civil/criminal), then yes they can call the police.