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Politics Government Your Rights Online

Massachusetts Joins the Real ID Fight 330

In the battle against big government and the infamous Real ID, Massachusetts has hopped on board. In the words of State Senator Richard T. Moore, D-Uxbridge, "Historically, Americans have resisted the idea, which totalitarian governments have tended to do, of having a national ID. That's the broad philosophical issue. I don't think it's a good move and I would be reluctant to see why we are going to that step." And State Attorney General Martha Coakley thinks "it's a bad idea." Should be interesting to see how it gets voted.
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Massachusetts Joins the Real ID Fight

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  • by Anonymous Coward on Monday May 07, 2007 @04:08PM (#19026425)
    This is heavily resisted in Europe too but many, many people have passports. What's the diff?
  • Re:Sadly... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by hsmith ( 818216 ) on Monday May 07, 2007 @04:09PM (#19026447)
    Actually it is two fold. They are making the states implement it, but the money they steal from the citizens in the form on national taxes are being used to blackmail the states into implementing the ID. So if the states don't go along with their fascist idea of a national ID, the fed keeps the money and spends it in other states. Thus, your freedom is being sold off for your own taxes.

    God bless the government and legalized blackmail
  • by zappepcs ( 820751 ) on Monday May 07, 2007 @04:12PM (#19026495) Journal
    The difference is that not everyone *HAS* to have a passport. Making a mandatory national ID is wrong. Passports are your ID internationally, not for use when buying cigarettes. A national ID would lead to ever more invasive tracking of citizen's activities. This is wrong.
  • Re:Sadly... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by gad_zuki! ( 70830 ) on Monday May 07, 2007 @04:20PM (#19026681)
    Yeah, its not like these "totalitarian governments" already have me:

    1. Registering for the draft at voting age.
    2. Getting a drivers license (barring that a state ID)
    3. Registering my car and license.
    4. Maintain a passport if I want to travel.
    5. Maintain a social security number.
    6. File state and federal taxes.
    7. Maintain a FOID card.
    etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc

    I like the national ID because it arguable can fold services 1, 2, 4, and 7 into one stupid card and cut the bureaucracy. Instead the states are busy protecting the jobs of their inane traffic/records bureaucracy and are afraid of the cost of modernization. Sadly, the 'state's rights' conservative crowd will cheer these bureaucracies on pretending they are protecting us from the next hitler or somesuch.
  • by griffjon ( 14945 ) <GriffJon&gmail,com> on Monday May 07, 2007 @04:42PM (#19027061) Homepage Journal
    To be fair, Ron Paul rejects *everything* - he's nicknamed Dr. No for a reason. It's almost like he believes in small, unobtrusive government (he's actually a libertarian). (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul) He also voted against the PATRIOT act, the Mil. Commissions act and the Iraq war... You've gotta respect the guy for having clear, thought-out views and sticking with 'em. I agree with him strongly on about 50% of his issues, and disagree strongly with the rest, but I can respect his position, and think it's a valuable voice to have in our Congress, which is more than I can say for... well, most of Congress, sadly.
  • Re:Sadly... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by dlenmn ( 145080 ) on Monday May 07, 2007 @04:57PM (#19027317)

    "...and cut the bureaucracy." Sorry, that will NEVER happen.
    Look, in general I'm as skeptical as anyone about government bureaucracy getting smaller, but it's not like there's a physical law stating that it's impossible -- I've seen it happen. It used to be when you wanted to get a passport in my area, you'd have to go to this tiny office in the county government center/court house that had bad hours and was always busy. Now you can go to any one of numerous post offices to do the same thing (with less waiting in line) -- some of them even do passports on weekends.

    A national ID certainly does have the potential to cut down on bureaucracy if it does combine many services that were previous separate.
  • Re:Passport? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by fyngyrz ( 762201 ) * on Monday May 07, 2007 @05:40PM (#19027981) Homepage Journal
    Ever try getting a Drivers License?

    What you need to realize is this is a brand new set of circumstances that you are accepting as "normal." I am 50, and I have had many drivers licenses in many states and several countries. Only in the last couple of decades has it been standard procedure for them to worry about your identity details; they used to be primarily concerned with your ability to drive, as absurd as that may seem to you. They used to ask (ask, mind you, not, demand papers proving) your age, your name, test you, and issue you a license if you didn't scare a year off the examiner's life (or maybe sometimes if you did... I used to live in south Florida, and I swear, the one thing you really had to watch out for was a little grey fuzz just barely sticking up over the steering wheel in front of you... the entire concept of "right of way" instantly became a fiction.) Anyway, there was no photo on the license, the number was an arbitrary one issued by the D/L department or equivalent, the name and birth-date were issued as described, and that was it. The issue was "can you drive" and nothing else. That is reasonable. What you accept as normal is what we used to use to laugh and point our fingers at the Soviets over. There are other issues peripheral to this; you can even find old references to them in pop culture. Watch "Hunt for Red October" and ponder when the sub's second officer asks the captain if you can drive "state to state" without papers. RealID is an internal passport. Nothing less.

  • by Ungrounded Lightning ( 62228 ) on Monday May 07, 2007 @05:48PM (#19028095) Journal
    ... other libertarians think that the individual unborn child is also sovereign and is deserving of the same human rights as everyone else...

    However not just libertarians but people of a large number of other political persuasions recognize the concept that a slave has a right to be free - even if the slaveowner's must be killed to accomplish this liberation.

    By this argument a woman would have an uncontested right to terminate a pregnancy at any time, despite the "unborn child"'s state as a "sovereign individual".

    Once the child is capable of independent viability it can be argued that its own rights mandate the MEANS of terminating the pregnancy might be limited to those that attempt to preserve the child's life - within the constraint of not adding risk to the life of the mother.

    = = = =

    Non-libertarian arguments based on the "personhood" of the fetus/unborn child bring up the question "when does it stop being anonymous tissue and become a person". My own preference for that time is "when the brain begins to function in a human fashion". (Before that you're dealing with either religious arguments over souls or claims that genetic potential = actuality which could justify rape and give cancers human rights.)

    A slippery slope that would lead to infanticide and euthanasia of the mentally "sub-par" can be avoided by pushing the cut-point back to the date when the nerve cells of the brain begin to interconnect. (Before that the brain is no more a "person" than a kit of chips and boards is a "computer".)

    Interestingly, this occurs about a week into the third trimester - just about the point where the Supreme Court, in Roe v. Wade, put the cutpoint between the sovereign interests of the mother and her doctor/patient relationship on one hand and the state's interest in preserving the life and rights of a new citizen on the other.
  • Re:Sadder still (Score:2, Interesting)

    by brandonbradley ( 950049 ) on Monday May 07, 2007 @06:48PM (#19028869)
    For my part I have taken to using my passport as my ID. Everyone pretty much has to accept it as it is a federal document that serves this purpose anyhow. In fact, why not just use passports as a national ID instead. The system for them is already in place, and it doesn't require a whole new set of id. Yes I realize the new passports have RFID built into them too, but then that is why I am hanging onto my existing one until that expires and hoping that by then they will get rid of or otherwise make the RFID more secure against ID theft than it currently is. I did recently though have my bank send me a new atm/debit card without my having asked for one and it turns out to be a RFID card that they are sending out as a "convenience" to customers. I gave it back to them and had it shredded. No thanks.
  • Re:Sadder still (Score:3, Interesting)

    by chuckymonkey ( 1059244 ) <charles@d@burton.gmail@com> on Monday May 07, 2007 @07:09PM (#19029037) Journal
    If enough people refuse the chip by breaking it, maybe someone somewhere will get the hint. Besides, it'll never come to what you suggest....at least not in my lifetime. If it does I'll move somewhere else.

He has not acquired a fortune; the fortune has acquired him. -- Bion

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