Greek, U.S. Officials Tapped For Years 236
Bruce Schneier posts on a story being reported in the Seattle Intelligencer. Greek and U.S. officials in Greece apparently had their phones tapped for over a year before the 2004 Olympics. From the article: "It was not known who was responsible for the taps, which numbered about 100 and included Greek Prime Minister Costas Caramanlis and his wife, and the ministers of foreign affairs, defense, public order and justice. Most of Greece's top military and police officers were also targeted, as were foreign ministry officials and a U.S. embassy number. Also tapped were some journalists and human rights activists." Schneier gives a bit of technical background on how the tapping was accomplished.
Re:Well duh (Score:5, Insightful)
Really, though, is this such a surprise? I'd think a foreign government would have to be bloody daft to accept any sort of tech built in the US where any sensitive communication is going to take place. You can make a no-click phone tap from a modem; you think that the US government can't do better? Or do you think that the Bush admin has the scruples not to tap its allies?
Re:Interesting (Score:3, Insightful)
Why can't we have... (Score:3, Insightful)
Actually the idea is as old as the MAD magazine, but with today's technology it could be implemented using public keys and a tiny modem in the headset.
voice -> data -> public-key encrypted data -> voice.
Ta-da!
Re:Why can't we have... (Score:2, Insightful)
1. Build encryptor for phones to hide nefarious deeds
2. Authorities take interest in you
3. Authorities tap your phone and find out that they can't decode your speech data
4. Authorities go "
At this point you are effectively putting head to head two computer systems:
1) The *hand held* device that you built to encode and decode speach in *real time* in order to hide what you are saying.
2) A multi room mega computer owned by the Authorities with a sole purpose of cracking coded data.
Wanna take bets as to which system will win in a test of wills???
First rule of phone tapping: (Score:5, Insightful)
"Omykod, neighbor, I just discovered a webcame in MY shower, too! Chekkidout!"
"Wow dude, someone put that same keylogger on my laptop, too! Here it is, right in the process list on my Windows Task Manager!"
"Greek Allies: Thank you for sharing your concerns that we were behind the recent suspicious rerouting of cell phone calls made by your top government officials. As you can see from the attached mobile phone company records, our embassy has been a victim of this heinous eavesdropping as well. We look forward to working with you to find the Real Perpetrators. Sincerely, CIA Field Chief -REDACTED-"
Comment removed (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Why can't we have... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Well duh (Score:1, Insightful)
Please friggin quit dropping Bush's name wherever you think there may be Evil(tm) going on. He's done some bad stuff, but lets not get carried away.
Re:So? (Score:5, Insightful)
It's interesting in many ways :
- it confirms what was previously just expected/suspected.
- The way in which it was done ( by installing software on the carrier's cell network that 'conferenced in prepaid phones' ) is definitely interesting.
- It was discovered.
Oh, and I've not read this anywhere else, but there's a post here which gives a few other details, including the mysterious "suicide" of one of the local security officials... not that I can tell you that it's anything real other than some radom dude posted something here, but still, that's interesting too, especially if true.
Anyway, I find it much more interesting than another RIM article or another CSS&HTML book review.
Must it be the US? (Score:1, Insightful)
As someone who has worked for the US government overseas before and studied a the subject of intelligence and international relations before, I can imagine a lot of others would love to (and probably have done) the same thing.
There's the old standbys - Russian intelligence, the Chinese, the Israelis, the British, and others. Of these, I'd say all are reasonably suspect with the possible exception of Israel (I know nothing about Israeli-Greek relations, please enlighten me if you know more on the subject).
There are regional powers that likely have the interest and capabilities to do so as well (Turkey, Cyprus, Albania perhaps).
Don't get me wrong - there's a fairly high probability the US had some hand in this and, like I said earlier, I wouldn't be shocked if the US was behind it. But I'd avoid jumping on that bandwagon too quickly without more information. There are a lot of other intelligence services out there, and they're very active in pursuing information.
Re:Who fucking cares? (Score:5, Insightful)
Once upon a time, there was a dike. It was just a simple dike, nothing special. The dike was built, as dikes are, to stop water from flowing all over. One day though, someone decided to break a little bit of the dike. Nothing too drastic. Just a little water flowing out. What's the harm, y'know? In fact, it's helpful to the people nearby, since they get some free water! Thus, the whole wasn't fixed. But this little hole soon started to get larger. Alright...well the people are getting more free water now! But this hole kept on getting larger. Eventually, the hole was so large that the dike was of no use anymore. All the people who were getting free water could now be found under that water.
Now, to come back to the topic at hand: What happens when the government finds out that it is "okay" to eavesdrop on its own citizens? That the people don't care one bit about the whole thing. The government starts to do it more often. Eventually, it is too large to stop. I could very well bring up the Nazis, but I'd prefer to not violate Godwin's law.
Stories such as these raise awareness to the fact. I remember reading a comment earlier today about how the RIAA was purposely initiating frivolous lawsuits (Such as suing the person who never used a computer.) simply to remind people that they are still actively hunting those 'evil pirates.' The more people are aware, the more they participate. For example, in the late-1700s and early-1800s, the literacy rate throughout Europe started to rise. At the same time, the level of participation within politics also rose. One of the primary causes of the French Revolution (and the Terror that followed) was the use of newspapers to raise awareness amongst the populace.
Nowadays, awareness is the first step toward action.
Re:Who fucking cares? (Score:1, Insightful)
Precedent counts for something (Score:3, Insightful)
It's not like the Executive Branch has just asserted its right to basically do what it pleases in the name of fighting terrorism, is it?
I understand your list of usual suspects, but something on the level of what's described doesn't sound like the Russians. Why would they do it? (And to the same objection about the States -- they've already proven their willingness and ability...)
Re:First rule of phone tapping: (Score:2, Insightful)
I think it was CIA (Score:4, Insightful)
I reckon that's either to test it, or so it could be denied later ('well we were bugged too').
If it was Israel, China etc, I bet they'd bug all the western embassies - it would just be an extra line in a configuration file.
Plus I know a few Ericsson switch engineers and they are all US or UK contract staff which rules out China or Russia to me (but maybe that has changed, maybe Ericsson use Russian staff now?) and Turkey Cyprus or Albania, forget it! Where would they get switch engineers from?
I hate to jump to conclusions too, but it looks highly likely, especially given the domestic spying without warrant in the USA, and the UN Kofi Annan spying incident, and the claimed kidnapping of Greek citizens by US & UK agencies.
Re:Interesting (Score:1, Insightful)
Now, for the truly paranoid, consider how much of that stuff is designed in US or allies of the US who have a track record of systems like Echelon, have the technical sophistication to design and install such devices and are intent on establishing a global hegemony via any means necessary.
All this China is going to cause the sky to fall is kinda getting old, paranoid and slightly offensive. How did the (peaceful) Japan-threat go? China will get more powerful (along with Europe, India, Russia and Brazil), but their growth rate will level off, just as Japan did.
Sure, it is possible that China is engaged in some massive spying operation (and you shouldn't dismiss it), but on balance of probabilities, this Slashdot comment is far more likely to pass through multiple US-controlled spying devices. Let's keep things in perspective.
Re:A few questions for Bush (Score:3, Insightful)
Gods don't kill people, people with gods kill people.
Those crazy super religious communists and facists! Killing all those millions of people in the name of Jesus! The mass murders of the 20th century, Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot etc etc all were religious zealots!
Oh... wait a second. Erhh...