Justice O'Connor Retiring 1157
rlbond86 writes "The New York Times reports that Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O'Connor will be retiring. Justice O'Connor, the first woman to become a Supreme Court justice, is considered by many the crucial 'swing vote' on many issues. How will this affect Supreme Court decisions in the future?" From the article: "Her departure, which had been the subject of rumors for weeks but was still a surprise, will give President Bush his first opportunity to name a justice to the Supreme Court. It is still not clear whether Chief Justice William H. Rehnquist, who is battling thyroid cancer and had been widely expected to resign, will step down this summer, giving Mr. Bush another seat to fill."
Replacing O'Connor will be tough... (Score:3, Insightful)
YRO.slashdot.org or Politics.slashdot.org? (Score:3, Insightful)
Be afraid... (Score:1, Insightful)
Supreme court appointments are no joke - these appointments will likely have more long reaching consequences than any other actions taken by this president.
Question. (Score:3, Insightful)
How is it determined which of the justices is the "swing vote"? Presumably, the swing vote is a concern in decisions that are split 5-4. But if there are 5 justices voting in a particular direction, how is it known which of those justices was undecided? (And, in fact, shouldn't they ALL be undecided until they've considered the merits of the particular case?)
Do the justices reveal their deliberation process? Or are particular judges just considered "swing votes" because they aren't consistent in the leaning of their decisions? (Which would also strike me as somewhat questionable behavior from a SC justice.)
Please enlighten me!
O'Connor was a Compassionate Conservative (Score:1, Insightful)
By contrast, Bush is not a compassionate conservative. He is a religious conservative and will attempt to replace O'Connor with an Ann-Coulter think-alike. The Democrats need to fulfill their responsibility to, not only Americans, but also to the citizens of the world; in short, the Democrats need to filibuster every single religious conservative that Bush nominates. So help me, Buddha.
Re:Huh..? (Score:2, Insightful)
What the current administration and the Christian groups will love to see is for Bush to push two conservative judges thus tilting the balance in SCOTUS firmly towards conservative rulings for the near future. Since Justice O'Connor mainly provided the swing vote in many rulings, its a clear win for the conservatives to replace her with someone that is far towards the right. If Bush suceeds (whether he wants to or he is forced to) expect a lot of contentious issues (think Roe Vs Wade, Prayer in Schools, Pornography, Flag burning) to end up again at SCOTUS.
This is one court that has always held me in awe, in the manner at which justice that has been passed down and the fairness of its rulings. I am afraid that is about to change, for good or bad.
Re:Let the... (Score:5, Insightful)
We already know the Republicans can, if push comes to shove, remove the filibuster option. Think about what this implies... Three branches of the government all controlled by a single party with a single (supposedly) agenda. What happens to checks and balances when there is no more balance, and checks become mere formalities?
Re:It is a big deal. (Score:3, Insightful)
With the recent close votes (Score:5, Insightful)
I personally supported almost nothing the previous president did, but I still respected him for being President of the United States.
Also note that the justices appointed don't always carry otu the 'wishes' of the appointer. President Ford, a fairly conservative leader, managed to get one of the more liberal judges appointed.
What we really need is to get judges who stop trying to legislate from the bench, and return to applying law to the case, not writing law for a case.
I wonder how the media will play this out? (Score:2, Insightful)
Sorry, I couldn't keep a straight face.
Re:Which way? (Score:1, Insightful)
Given that we have a GOP-controlled House, Senate, and Presidency which kowtows to the fundie nutbars, it's almost certian we're going to get a hardcore far right judge as a replacement. When that happens, kiss the Bill of Rights goodbye.
Re:Florida, Florida (Score:2, Insightful)
You mean who helped stop the Fla court from changing the local election law after the election. Well, I guess it doesn't matter. The LA Times, NY Times, and Washington Post all conducted their own independent counts and found that GWB was the winner.
Re:Question. (Score:3, Insightful)
Sandra was the one who was most likely to change groups she voted with on any issue; therefore she was the swing voter. And therefore this is a very important position for Bush to fill: If he can get someone who will vote the way Bush wants, Bush can likely get the whole SCOTUS weight on his side.
Of course, Justices are not known for doing what the people who appointed them want them to do. Sandra, for instance, was appointed by Reagan, who was a very conservative president...
Re:It is a big deal. (Score:1, Insightful)
The Democrats lost! Get over it and quit harping on old news. Spend your efforts finding a candidate that can connect with someone besides the hard left-wing liberals. Use your energy wisely.
Re:With the recent close votes (Score:2, Insightful)
Public ConServants (Score:3, Insightful)
So the Justices are all conservative. The only question is how conservative, or whether they're really radical (changing the root), or just using conservative language to make new changes.
Seems to me Bush won reelection (Score:2, Insightful)
You might not like it, but it's the truth. And you wouldn't mod me down just because you disagree with me, would you?
Re:Public ConServants (Score:1, Insightful)
Indeed, fundimentalists would be call "liberals" or "leftists" in any other era.
Re:Replacing O'Connor will be tough... (Score:3, Insightful)
I don't think Bush can mess up the SCOTUS any more than it is already. Please don't forget that it was the left leaning justices who gave your local officials the right to take your property if they deem it to be in the public interest. And I believe most local public officals can be easily purchased by a WalMart looking for a new home.
Nice job SCOTUS.
Re:Great! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:It is a big deal. (Score:4, Insightful)
Bush's first gutless act was going to the feds to settle a state issue. What happened to states rights? Strict Constructionist he says...
Medical Marijuana,
Assisted Suicide.
If he was so sure he was going to win the recount he should have let it be.
Same for Gore too... He should have asked ALL counties to recount. Not just the democratic ones.
Yes I am a liberal. So what? If everybody in America walked in lock step with Bush this truly would be a scary place. There are two parties for a reason.
Debate, etc...
--ken
Re:It is a big deal. (Score:2, Insightful)
What are you talking about?? Clinton administration policy was for regime change in Iraq, Gore is on record before 2000 calling for regime change in Iraq,
A) They were wrong. B) You're taking what they said out of context. C) Bush has been such a stubborn ass that he won't change any policy, no matter how badly it fails. D) Repeating lies don't make it true.
and most importantly it's been shown that Bush would have ultimately won any Florida recount anyway!
That is a lie. Also, anyone -- anyone -- who supports unverifiable electronic voting should be shot.
Re:Replacing O'Connor will be tough... (Score:4, Insightful)
Example 1: 9/11, and intelligence agencies not playing well together. That's her job. Example 2: Ignoring Richard Clarke [msn.com]. Example 3: No WMDs in Iraq. Example 4: Allowing DoD to ignore State's reconstruction plans, completely screwing up the postwar.
Also, middle class is not poverty [timesonline.co.uk]. You seem both very race-focused and very ignorant of Condi's background. She's apparently a trained classical pianist as well as an ice skater. Both of these are impressive accomplishments, but they don't mean she'll be good as Secretary of State. Talent is not fungible.
Re:Question. (Score:5, Insightful)
O'Connor is a "swing" voter because sometimes she reasons based upon a strict interpretation and at other times reasons based upon a more creative interpretation of the constitution. It has nothing to do with Centrism. The fact that constructionists are aligned with the right and the "living document" wing is aligned with the left is merely an accident of what the constitution actually is.
I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:3, Insightful)
Personally I'm a moderate, and I agreed with a lot of O'Connor's decisions, particularly recent were her decisions on eminent domain (although I agree with her Pro-Choice stance too). I can't help but feel all of America is about to get the hard end of the stick with Bush's next appointee. And if he decides to be the angry child he normally is, I have no doubts the government will cease to function in Washington over this next nomination.
Let the war begin!
Re:Let the... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Let the... (Score:5, Insightful)
Odds are, three branches of Republicanism will probably inspire enough "broken glass" Democrat voting to turn a lot of red states blue next time around, so it's far from a permanent arrangement.
The problem with the Democrats right now is that their core constituency resides on the far ends of the economic bell-curve: The dirt-poor and the "old money" rich.
The vast majority of salary-earning, 401K-owning, mortgage-holding, middle class folk seemed to like Clinton fine, because riding that bubble sure was a lot of fun, but the rise of the "Deaniacs" has kind of alienated a lot of those people, to the point that they are even willing to put up with the things they don't like about Bush and his Country Club buddies.
The Democrats, if they want to survive as a viable party, desperately need a way that they can talk to somebody who's currently making $50,000 a year (and hopes to be making over $100,000 within the next five), and get that person to think the Democrats have their best interests at heart. Whining about the "gap" in the already-too-expensive medicare drug benifits ain't going to do it, and neither is constant harping on the war issues.
Were I in charge of the DNC, I would be making overtures to the libertarians. Become the anti-PATRIOT Act party, the anti-RICO party, the anti-"War on Drugs" party. Let the hard-core socialists run off with the Greens, and establish Clinton-style triangulation on budget issues (wiping out the GOP's second-biggest vote-getter) while becoming the ultimate champions of individual liberty. Stealing the entire middle ground would be a piece of cake.
The Democrats, unfortunately, are moving in the opposite direction. They seem to be systematically purging the Clintonistas of the party, and rallying around the most shrill and bitter voices in their party.
I firmly believe there's going to be a huge political realignment within this generation. The Democrats are either going to radically evolve, or else present the Greens, Libertarians, and even the remnants of the Reform Party with a golden opportunity to become America's main Republican opposition.
Re:Replacing O'Connor will be tough... (Score:5, Insightful)
I wish we *didn't* have political parties, but it's a little late for that; the barn door on that has long since rotted away.
Re:With a bit of luck..... (Score:3, Insightful)
That being said, Sandra was one of the few judges who dissented against the recent property-grab decision. My worry is that Bush will nominate someone who is right-wing rather than a Constructionist to replace her. Someone who makes laws from scratch to favor the right is just as bad as or worse than a judge who makes laws from scratch to favor the left.
Re:Seems to me Bush won reelection (Score:5, Insightful)
While I'm scoffing, let me take up the senate. Do me a favor: go figure out what percentage of the population are represented by Republicans and Democrats in the senate. Okay, I'll give you the answer: you'll figure out that Democrats represent more than 50% of the population in the senate, even though they're in the minority.
This "up-or-down vote" is just a front for the Republicans' desire for a tyranny of the majority. Finally Democrats are standing up to them, and rightly so.
Well, no, I'd mod you down because you're a thoughtless shill.
Re:Great! (Score:1, Insightful)
This is why it went for eminent domain.
Neo-cons love corporations.
This court is far closer to fascist then liberal. Of course to Americans in general (the mouth breathing fox news watching type) this is considered to be great. This way we can have the worst of all sides of the political spectrum. Companies can have property seized for them by the government, screw you out of health care in the form of HMO decisions that let people to save a few dollars and then claim anyone who disagrees with them a terrorist.
Every day I feel ashamed for our country. But I may yet have to move back to my birthplace to avoid what the future members of SCOTUS will allow their corporate master to do to the common people.
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:4, Insightful)
One can only hope. You forget that the same corrupt party controls two branches of government, and is gunning for the third. And frankly, they're a lot better at pandering to ignorance and fear, so they'll get the vast majority of the public behind them.
I can hope we get another David Souter. I think we're going to get one that makes Thomas look like Ginsburg. Maybe even two.
The next 20 years look grim.
Re:Replacing O'Connor will be tough... (Score:3, Insightful)
Do you want activist judges or do you want judges who follow the law?
You don't like the Kelo case - you shouldn't. [blogspot.com] But the remedy is not at the federal court level; there's no case law or precedent to support it.
Most states already prohibit these kind of takings - you know, the kind of taking of private land that made Bush millions of bucks when it was done in Texas. [mollyivins.com] The rest of the states should follow suit, but it would be legislating from the bench if the Supremes would have done it..
Re:Question. (Score:2, Insightful)
Yes, and the problem is that one small group of people, the party leadership for the GOP, will control both houses of Congress, the Executive Office, and the Supreme court. They will be able to pass just about any law they want, sign it, and uphold it in court.
That's exceptionally dangerous.
Re:Nothing to worry about (Score:5, Insightful)
Of course, this all depends on who the President picks as a replacement. If he picks Alberto Gonzales (currently attourney general), all hell may break loose.
Re:Seems to me Bush won reelection (Score:5, Insightful)
And one of his platforms during the campaign was nominating solidly conservative justices. Additionally, the GOP gained seats in the Senate in the last election. Seems like the people have spoken. Bush should be able to nominate the jutices he wants, and get an up-or-down vote, not be dictated to by the likes of Ted Kennedy and Moveon.org.
Dictated? Coming to a compromise is not "dictating." Democraces are built upon compromise, and the tyranny of the majority is still tyranny. Why shouldn't he appoint someone who both sides agree upon, instead of trying to comletely silence fully half of the country? Sen. Reid, the leading Democrat in the Senate, has already offered up a list of Republican candidates [yahoo.com] who they would be willing to negotiate over. But the usual tactic for Republicans is to give a rats ass about actually being democratic, so I'm sure they'll attempt to run roughshod over the American public again.
Re:Bush names successor (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:With a bit of luck..... (Score:5, Insightful)
Or were you really that offended when the 'activist judges' blocked Congress' grandstanding attempt to reinsert Terry Schiavo's feeding tube?
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:4, Insightful)
George Bush has never made it a secret exactly what his views on society are. He is a conservative, just as he was WHEN HE WAS ELECTED PRESIDENT.
The majority of this country chose him knowing full well that he would appoint judges who believed as he did. Why shouldn't he therefore follow the wishes of the majority of the country and do JUST THAT?
So when you say that "I can't help but feel all of America is about to get the hard end of the stick with Bush's next appointee," what you SHOULD be thinking is that if Bush appoints a judge of HIS choosing, the majority of the country will WIN. Only if the democracts are allowed to win this battle will the country get the "hard end of the stick."
Re:Which way? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:respect (Score:3, Insightful)
And using disrespect, or even actually holding the belief that he's not the POTUS, to make a point is definitely covered under freedom of speech. It speaks volumes about any writer's intent when opting for Mr. Bush or just Bush, over President Bush.
If the write is serious, he would use one of the above, but if they are just spouting propaganda, maybe Dubya, or George W, or something equally derogatory. Which is Also covered under free speech.
Though I doubt many people would care to address him personally as Mr. Bush, the office carries respect, even if the person holding it does not.
Re:Let the... (Score:3, Insightful)
Republic of Gilead (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Which way? (Score:5, Insightful)
I very mugh disagree. If this last week is any indication...:
- conservative side of the court dissenting when the SCOTUS threw out state and personal rights in favor of federal prohibition of medical marijuana
- dissenting when the SCOTUS
If you look at how "liberal" (not to be confused with classical liberalism) judges view the Constitution and Bill of Rights (as a "living document" that much change with the times and social moreys) and contrast it with how the conservative judges view the Constitution & BoR (as things to be interperited/implemented as the authors intended) it is pretty obvious that there is more potential for a liberal court to throw out individual rights (as an antequated idea), welcome socialism (as a replacement for the limited government defined in the constitution), and otherwise head down many other slopes that lead away from what the US was founded on.
I probably share with you in fearing that an authoritarian, statist (as opposed to libertarian) judge could take the bench...but I think that's more likely with a liberal judge (and even if not, a liberal reading of the constitution would likely be more permissive or an authoritarian legislature and executive.
There are no constructionalists (Score:5, Insightful)
What we really have is two camps of judges, one who promotes the increase of federal power for the liberal agenda, and another camp which promotes the increase of federal power for the conservative agenda.
A constructionalist would do neither....
Re:Great! (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Huh..? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Which way? (Score:3, Insightful)
For the longest time you have probably heard the conservatives in the country talking about how the federal government is imposing too many rules and regulations on states and how this is a bad thing.
This decision is a victory (if you can call it that) for states rights because the court ruled that states have control over their own domain (no Seinfeld jokes thank you). It is the states who can decide who can build what and under what circumstances.
In this case the state decided that they could make more money buy having a private business on property on which citizens now reside.
In essence, the conservatives of the country got what they've asking for: limited federal intrusion onto the right of a state to conduct its affairs.
While I understand the logic of the court I don't agree with the decision. Even allowing that the people will be fairly compensated for their home and land (don't bet on it) and that they have had their due process of law (as required by the 5th Amendment) this ruling will come back to haunt the justices and everyone else.
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:5, Insightful)
The judicial branch is supposed to be above partisan politics. Judges are appointed for life at the federal level. Regardless of a judge's MORAL stance on an issue, they are to rule according to the LAW, and the Constitution. That's why abortion remains legal in this country. Regardless of whether or not you feel abortion is a sin, or morally repugnant, or whatever, abortion seems to be allowed by the Constitution.
Now, as a snide side comment, Bush wasn't elected by a majority of this country. (Although he was re-elected by a majority. Go figure).
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Public ConServants (Score:3, Insightful)
Obscuring the actions of Christian fundamentalists with a semantic smokescreen is disingenuous. Merely citing the dictionary without respect to the context is naive. Both are dangerous, hiding some of America's best organized and radical activists from public discussion of their activities. Especially in the context of Bush, a fundamentalist spokesmodel, appointing at least one new Justice to the Supreme Court.
Judicial versus Political Conservativism (Score:4, Insightful)
Justice Scalia is very judicially conservative, and sometimes that conflicts with his political views. When faced with that choice, he chooses to be judicially conservative. Even Rehnquist, who is definitely a political conservative, is not nearly as judicially conservative as you would expect if you equated the two traits as one.
Of course, it is extremely rare to have a dichotomy on the liberal side of things, because political liberals want things to be a certain way and judicial liberals are really good at reading the Constitution to mean just what they want it to. You will rarely, if ever, find a politically liberal judicial conservative.
My personal hope is that Bush appoints someone who is judicially conservative and politically moderate. But he wouldn't do that any more than Kerry would have appointed Cheney to the bench.
Re:It is a big deal. (Score:2, Insightful)
Nothing would get posted on the internet if everyone had to cite something when making a statement, but if you're going to yell LIAR LIAR at someone, at least have the decency to post one link supporting your insulting allegation.
Re:It is a big deal. (Score:2, Insightful)
the "progressives" (Score:2, Insightful)
They are just as much to blame as so called "conservatives" when it comes to thievery, being bribed or blackmailed, or being in the pockets of fascist transnational corporations.
Bottom line, if it's elected, appointed or hired on and it comes from government, expect to lose if you have something they want. Labels mean nothing beyond "private citizen or governmental employee", those are the ones that count. And for that matter, pay no attention to those ridiculous D and R labels, they are designed to keep the rabble occupied thinking they have some vague "voice" in government. There's about as much difference as between the Crips and the Blood.
Re:Let the... (Score:3, Insightful)
Really?? They guys running the show couldn't be any farther to the right. There is a reason George Bush senior isn't part of the adminstration. He would be run out as a liberal just like Colin Powell & Christie Todd Whitman.
I think its funny how all these Republicans are running away from George W. They remember the good time in 90's listening to Rush Limbaugh when there wasn't somebody in office trying to actually implement crazy ideas like privitizing social security. Many Republicans rather keep it as an idea and say "only if".
Re:Replacing O'Connor will be tough... (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes, since the Democratic party has no strong, intelligent black women. Idiot.
Jocelyn Elders [military.com] was fired for suggesting that teenagers should be taught masturbation isn't evil. Condi Rice can tell Congress that no one could have expected planes to be flown into buildings - after the X-Files, Tom Clancy, and antimissile defenses at Genoa - and get promoted.
By the way, Jocelyn Elders worked as a maid to support herself while in college. I think her background is a wee bit more humble than Condi Rice's.
Most of the criticism I hear of her, like yours, is highly partisan.
So it's partisan to expect a political appointee to be competent at their job, or to demonstrate some understanding of what that is?
Or is it just partisan to assign responsibility to Republicans?
Or is Richard Clarke - a man who served under four presidents, three Republican - 'partisan'
Or does saying "partisan" allow you to turn your brain off and ignore criticism?
Re:AAAAAAAARGH! (Score:2, Insightful)
There isn't a chance in hell that Rehnquist will be replaced with a more intellegent and legally sound justice. When you read his rulings, even if you disagree with him philosophically, you have to respect the guy for his noggin.
Re:Which way? (Score:3, Insightful)
Err, Whatever... (Score:4, Insightful)
Why is an expansionist view of judical power bad? In Common Law and in particular in the US, one of the few things that keeps the Legistlature in check is judicial review. The fact the far elements in Congress want things like a Flag Burning amendment is because the restraints the judiciary puts on them.
What Mr Franck should have said is that he is disappointed because O'Conner kept deciding against things he liked instead of trying to pull the "flip flop" card. Being mad a judge for deciding against what they desire does not make that judge bad.
Re:Great! (Score:5, Insightful)
First, to you, !conservative != liberal. Also liberal != more government. Actually the party in control of the government is for more government and the minority usually takes up states' rights.
To the rest of people, you're intent on thinking that Republican == conservative, when it doesn't. Furthermore, on the supreme court, "liberal" and "conservative" mean different things than we're all used to.
Regarding the court, the Kelo v. New London was a "liberal" decision in that it tended to give a loose constructionist interpretation of the constitution. It was by no means in line with liberal political views. No one liked that decision except for statists and corporatists.
Took from the Individual, gave to the state (Score:5, Insightful)
In the recent medical marijuana case and "out of state wine purchases" case the SCOTUS took the control out from the states and gave it to the federal government. Yes, technically they ruled that the federal gov't already had control, but the result was less state control.
In the eminent domain case they took the rights from the individual to his property and gave it to the government. While they didn't rule that the constitution prohibited this, it was still a case of control moving up hill, away from individuals.
So IMHO, I wouldn't call that a benefit for states rights, but a continuation on the theme of rights and control moving farther away from the individual. Additionally, I don't think the eminent domain case means the states the only one who can wrest property from the owners, I'm sure the federal gov't could do it as well. All they ruled was the individual is not the master of their domain ( no Seinfeld joke )
So if the gov't wants your property, even if the reason is that some other person "bribed" them with the promise of more taxes, there's nothing you can do but stand there holding your... ( Seinfeld joke here )
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:3, Insightful)
You misunderstand the point of the judicial branch. The point of the judicial branch is to make sure that the other branches don't abuse their powers, and that the other branches don't shred the Constitution.
That's nice and all in abstract, but who watches the judicial brance to make sure THEY don't shred the constitution? After all, the whole reason that we have a democracy, 3 branches of government, and checks and balances is because human beings are fallible. If we could find a perfect human beings who make perfect decisions everyone agrees with we could create a dictatorship with all decisions made by that one person. But there is no such person. And the current supremes are obviously biased by their internal politics and beliefs. Most observers can predict what each supreme will do, not based on the observation of law, but each supreme's perception of reality and what is right and wrong.
The danger is that the Supreme Court does not have the same checks and balances as Congress or the President. Supremes are not elected, have lifetime memberships, and the only way to theoretically overrule a decision is to amend the constitution. The more decisions that the Supremes make that overrules the elected bodies, the less we become a republic and the more we become a autocratic society.
BrianJames Madison at 7200 RPM (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Seems to me Bush won reelection (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:1, Insightful)
From what I've read, the senate (including the Democrats) approved over 200 federal judges in Bush's first term. The Democrats fillibustered 10. That's right, less than 5%. Now, how can you possibly say "the only "comprimise" that the democrats will be satisfied with is appointing a liberal judge"? That is pure crap. They compromised over 95% of the time.
As for the "angry child" bit, Bush didn't veto a single law in his first term. He liked everything that came out of congress. He had 10 of his judges block, so what did he do? He sent them back to try again. No explanation, no bargaining, no changes. He's just going to try the exact same thing over again. When he didn't get his way the second time, he had a temper tantrum, and dragged his party into it with him. He thinks everything should go his way because his party has a majority, and is furious that he doesn't have the 60% needed in order to be able to completely blow off the other party.
Personally, I consider myself to be slightly on the "conservative" side. I favor small government, fiscal responsibility, a strong military, strict enforcement of laws. I hate that people can get by (or even do well) without working for a living. Sadly, though, I find myself totally alienated by the Republican party's strategy lately, and it feels like a lot of it is coming from Pres. Bush. Probably the worst of it is their holier-than-thou attitude. Basically, "We have a majority, and we know what is Right, so we will do it no matter what anyone else says." No explanations, no compromise, no apologies. Those would show weakness, and we can't have that. That they cop this attitude with 51% support is just absurd, because they ignore the opinion of half the population they are supposed to represent.
You would think that a devout Christian like Bush would realize that only God is right all the time, and as a human he will inevitably make mistakes. By refusing to admit that he does, he is blasphemous. But then, I don't consider him a good Christian at all. He talks about it a lot, but doesn't practice it at all.
So when you say that "I can't help but feel all of America is about to get the hard end of the stick with Bush's next appointee," what you SHOULD be thinking is that if Bush appoints a judge of HIS choosing, the majority of the country will WIN.
The majority isn't always right. It is very possible (and historically common) for the majority to choose a bad course of action. (Godwin: Hitler was elected by a majority. Hussein, too.) I happen to believe that Bush received a re-election based on a successful FUD campaign, not based on his qualities or ideals as a leader. More controversially, I believe that the majority is misguided on several subjects and in a decade or two they will come around and see that they made some bad choices.
Any of these things can completely invalidate your last paragraph.
I'll take that. (Score:5, Insightful)
Do you know what "racist" means? Would you find her as "impressive" if she was a white woman?
How about "classist"? Would you find her as "impressive" if she were a rich white woman?
How about we wrap this up and check if you would find a rich white man as "impressive" with the same list of accomplishments since being appointed?
I didn't think so. And before you go off making claims about how you aren't racist, be sure you include specific accomplishments. No one cares about some rich white guy learning to play the piano.You can believe whatever you want.
But, just maybe, you should look at what the differences between those two really are. Why don't you try naming them, other than one was a liberal and the other was not.The fact is, our current regime claimed over and over that Saddam had them and that we knew where they were.
How do they spell "lies" on your world?How do you define "human rights"?
Is it okay if we only kill 1/10th the number of people that Saddam did as long as we're doing it as part of the "war on terror"?
How does killing innocent people equate to "human rights"?
And before you go off on how many people Saddam killed, you'd better be damn sure you want to start making comparisions between the USofA and a 3rd world tin-pot dictator.
Re:The point of the judicial branch... (Score:5, Insightful)
It's part of the "checks and balances" the 3 branches are meant to have on each other. Of course, this implies that after confirmation, the executive or legislative branch can check the power of the Court, but since they have never done it, it seems they are either happy with the situation or lack the will to exercise their own powers. I find either possibility unacceptable.
The fact of the matter is that the Court is increasingly issuing rulings based on anything BUT the Constitution, citing things like morality, changing times, foreign law, or "emanations of penumbras" (translation: "I'm trying to rationalize the fact that I pulled this out of my ass"), and have all but stated that the original intentions of the Founders who wrote this magnificent document, and in many cases the clear, plain English words contained therein simply don't matter in this so-called politically, socially and scientifically enlightened age.
If the Court would get back to what's actually WRITTEN down in the Constitution, combined with a clear understanding of the intent of the language and a sharp dose of common sense, and stop making things up just to suit their political or moral prejudices or to suit the new pressure group du jour, we would all be a lot better off. Of course, it will never happen, because then the other two brances would be forced to acknowledge that 4/5 of what the Federal Government does uses powers never granted by the Constitution, and that through increasingly (small 'l') liberal and tangential interpretation of the Interstate Commerce Clause, the very idea of the Federal government being restricted to only those powers specifically enumerated has become irrelevant.
In other words, they threw the Constitution under the bus decades ago to serve the interests of big business, post-morality "morals", extremist pressure groups, a sense of universal entitlement and their own hyper-inflated sense of self-importance.
Once upon a time, a bunch of really smart guys got together to form a new country based on the idea of supreme and inalienable individual rights. They drew upon and expanded traditions that had developed largely in Europe and had existed in various forms since the days of the Romans and the ancient Greeks.
In their wisdom, they decided it best to surrender a small amount of these rights (but not life, liberty ot the pursuit of happiness) to a small, explicitly and narrowly defined Federal government, whose primary purpose was to help the united, but largely autonomous, states to engage in fair commerce, defend themselves against foreign aggressors, and to make sure that the rights of the individual states, and more importantly the people are preserved... and very little else.
It's ironic in the 21st century to even consider that there was a faction of the Constitutional Convention that felt the Bill of Rights was completely superfluous, as it spelled out the obvious, and that the Federal government as defined by the Constitution could never possibly usurp those God-given rights spelled out therein. Nowadays, the average American will not only recognize those rights, but a substantial portion of them think those rights go to far. If you look over the Bill of Rights today, the only right spelled out therein that I think we can all agree has not been watered down, whittled away or completely tossed out is the right to not have soldiers quartered in your house. And I wouldn't hold me breath if, God forbid, there is ever military conflict on American soil.
In the Federalist Papers, you will see the great lengths the various Founders go to explain the huge advantage the unity will provide in terms of global economics and security, but they also believed that such a union would only be just if it were voluntary. As we know, this was changed radically less than 100 years later, as was the very (small 'c') constitution of the Federal gov
Re:Bring on another Scalia (Score:1, Insightful)
God, what a bunch of fucking whiners Republicans and Libertarians are.
"Waah, we want the government to control who sleeps with who, and what people do in their own houses, and whether they can smoke something other than tobacco or ingest some drug other than alcohol. In fact, if we disagree with something on 'moral' grounds, it should be legislated, heavily. But if it involves economic policy, don't let the government decide anything at all."
Yeah, let's be just like Taliban Afghanistan, a fucking warlord state ruled by fundamentalist, religious nutcases.
Stupid fuck nut, you, Bush, and Scalia are the ones destroying America.
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:5, Insightful)
How can you hope for another David Souter after his recent ruling on eminent domain [slashdot.org]??? People don't seem to understand that both the Democrats and Republicans are now statist parties. Just b/c the Democrats oppose the Republicans doesn't mean they're suddenly libertarian good guys.
And to set the record straight, it was the conservative, Republican-appointed judges who opposed this decision - three of Reagan's four judges (Rehnquist, Scalia, Connor, but not Kennedy) and one of Bush Sr's two judges (Thomas, but not Souter) opposed the ruling [supremecourtus.gov][pdf]. Furthermore, it is Congressional Republicans introducing legislation to mitigate its damage [volokh.com], while Congressional Democrats state both their opposition to that legislation [nationalreview.com] and support of the Kelo decision [billhobbs.com]. Of course, there are plenty of examples of people on both sides of political spectrum opposing this [washingtontimes.com], even socialists, so it's much more complex than the typical dumbed-down Democrat-vs-Republican football match. So enough of the uninformed, knee-jerk reactions please, and we'll take two more Rehnquists President Bush, thank you very much.
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:With the recent close votes (Score:3, Insightful)
Sure:
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:5, Insightful)
This dramtic oversimplification brought to you by the American Black and White Idealism Committee, bringing you opinions void of thought for over two hundred years.
I won't claim objectivity, since anyone that does so is lying or fooling themselves, but George Bush is the least compromising individual I have ever witnessed in a position of authority. Some call it "staying the course", and "determined leadership", but it is really just euphemistic for "don't confuse me with facts, I've already made up my mind".
The idea that every branch of our federal government can now be dominated by the agendas and members of the far conservative right, especially after Rehnquist finally bites it, with nothing to temper it towards a moderate stance, should be deeply concerning to anyone that doesn't buy into the same beliefs as the staunch conservatives and the fire and brimstone Christians. Even for conservatives, this may well lead us to a government too far right for comfort.
Add to this the continued Republican policies of deficit spending, something they have decried the now oddly fiscally responsible Democrats for years about, and you have a recipe for the alienation and fracture of American society and America as a respected world power, not to mention the economic disaster that the current financial policy puts in our future.
Re:VACANCY (Score:1, Insightful)
But to answer the why: he memorialized these things because he needed to provide cover for the violation of law Bush had decided to participate in. Torture is at least part of why the war is going so poorly (complete loss of moral ground & makes our soldiers that much more at risk). At any rate, Bush should be reminded (write 100 times on the chalkboard): Don't invade sovereign nations on false pretenses if you want to stay on the legal side of international law. Furthermore, don't seek out legal counsel to write legal documents trying to stretch jurisprudence to justify torture in spite of the Constitutionally-mandated Geneva Conventions (and basic common sense/human decency).
It isn't any surprise (to me at least) that Bush, back when he governed Texas, signed a historic number of death warrants. That's just the way he is. Power to destroy human life. Now the question is: is putting power above human life the right wing value it seems to be? And, does extremist need to be a modifier in these context anymore? Right wing seems to sum it up these days. Not a pretty picture.
But you are reflected by those you choose to lead you. Drunk driving convict. Property theft conviction during College. C grade point average (at schools he could not have gotten into on his merits). Missing in action from the war of his age (AWOL according to the records that exist). Business failure except in an eminent domain taking. Morally-bankrupt governorship. Worst president in history.
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:2, Insightful)
No, some judges decided that *THEIR* MORAL stance required abortion to be legal, and so created what is generally seen (even by many pro-legal-abortion people) to be one of the WORST legal decisions ever. The judicial branch has been going crazy the last few decades with allowing the federal government's powers to expand.
Now, since Bush is the legally elected president, it's his prerogative to nominate judges who have a similar judicial theory to his own (probably some sort of originalism or other strict interpretation theory). Unless the Senate has some serious reservations about the person's ability to perform the function (not 'they may rule against my positions') then they should be confirmed.
Re:This is the WORST time for a justice to retire (Score:5, Insightful)
Only if one of the liberal members decided to step down would you see a massive swing in policy.
I agree with you, except for one thing: There aren't any big-L Liberals on the court.
The closest thing to a liberal is Justice Stevens, and he only seems so because the rest of the court is so right-wing. Blackmun, Brennan, and Marhshall were all more liberal than Stevens and were replaced by more conservative justices.
What we have is 1 moderate liberal (Stevens) 3 centrist judges (Souter, Ginsberg, and Breyer) and 1 moderate conservative (Kennedy) and 3 extreme conservatives (Rehnquist, Scalia, and Thomas). O'Connor was typically another moderate conservative. She or Kennedy would usually be the decider in close cases.
Of course I expect George W. "Uniter, not a Divider" to nominate someone like Scalia or Thomas. After all, he was quoted as saying they were his favorite Justices.
Also one thing people forget to SOME extent, is that history tends to show that supreme court justices, no matter who pics them, generally have done their job as described, and thats to interpret the constitution and laws as set forth by Congress and the President.
In past Administrations, I would agree. But this Administration has made a partisan mockery of nearly every function of government. Scientific reports have been edited by industry insiders. Intelligence has been "fixed" to support policy. FEAR has been used to drive policies that have nothing to do with security.
I'm betting he nominates John Ashcroft.
Re:Public ConServants (Score:3, Insightful)
Freedom from a tyrannical state was as much a fear (if not more so) than a foreign invasion. Parse the sentence how you will, but the intent Clearly was to protect against both other nations AND a tyrannical federal government. (not to mention the ability to defend and protect one's natural rights from bandits etc.) If you think the second amendment is no longer valid, fine, just amend the constitution. That is precisely why the amendment process is there.
An example of my own, is the interstate commerce clause. Nowhere was it inferred or implied that the interstate commerce clause gives the federal government the power to PROHIBIT commerce. It was understood that the power was to protect free commerce FROM interference. If this was not the case, then the 18th amendment would not have been needed since the power to prohibit the trade in liquor would have already existed.
Re:Let the... (Score:3, Insightful)
Double or tripple? I'm in the 25% tax bracket right now and the max is 35%. According to you with a flat everyone would be paying 50-75% (including those currently paying 35%).
You don't understand how the current tax system works. I'm in the 25% bracket (for some of my income) but I pay nothing like 25% of my income to the feds.
The actual number is closer to 3%. Moderate income, two kids, house, state/property taxes, some charitable donations wipe out virtually all the tax for someone like me. (And I'm not uncommon- in fact, we're quite close to the median American family.)
The one area I'm really different is adopting my kids. The adoption tax credit is going to set my federal taxes to 0 for the next few years. The credit makes it possible for normal people to handle the expenses involved- eliminating it will seriously hurt adoption in the US, toss more kids into foster care and end up costing the taxpayers money in the long run.
You Just Can't Tell (Score:3, Insightful)
Bush Sr promoted Kennedy who he thought was a lot more conservative than he turned out to be. O'Connor was supposed to more conservative than she turned out to be.
When you are promoted to SCOTUS, you've reached the pentultimate spot. You can't be fired and it's almost impossible to impeach you. Now, you can do what you want, everyone else, presidents, congress, be damned.
I'm not worried in the slightest.
Re:Public ConServants (Score:3, Insightful)
Probably your most important distortion is how "the civil rights issue" caused three southern states to switch. Yes, white southerners sided with the Democrats while the party produced racists like Alabama's George Wallace, promising to protect their jobs from management above, and blacks below. The racists have now found a home in the Republican Party, as they foolishly believe that Republican exclusionary culture will protect their remaining privileges, though they are themselves excluded from any benefits but promises to turn the country into a "more Christian one".
So it's no surprise that you ignore Carter's negotiations with the Iranians, whose revolution kicked out the Shah propped up by Nixon during the creation of OPEC. Of course you don't mention the simultaneous negotiations of the Republicans, to keep the hostages until Reagan was inaugurated, which deal was honored in exchange for illegal military assistance known as "Iran/Contra" by those with more complete histories than yours. Your boys instead armed Iran, and entrenched their government, while simultaneously backing Iraq, and its chemical warfare. Creating both the monsters that are our biggest foreign threat today. Except perhaps for Pakistan, the source of the Taliban and probable home of bin Ladin. Or Saudi Arabia, source of 19 of the 9/11/2001 planebombers, and the apparently the majority of the suicide bombers in Iraq. Or the nuclear program they accomplished while your boys, Reagan and Bush, ensured we pumped maximum money and security into their tyrannical regimes, to say nothing of your Saudi hand, cheek and ass-kissing president now covering these enemies with more cover than we can even produce.
Now, I've gone on long enough just adding a little balance to your unilateral distortion of history. I could add all kinds of Democratic malfeasance, like Johnson's prefiguration of Iraq in the Gulf of Tonkin, Carter's refuge for the Shah, protection of Ceausescu, benevolent neglect of Peron and Pinocet. Or Clinton's coddling Indonesia among various other tyrannical client states.
But I'm not going to hide the manipulation of "faith-based" (nonrational) American voters behind the complicity of Presidents in multinational corporate tyranny. Because that would be just as devious as hiding the agenda of these fundamentalists behind meaningless political labels. The people we're talking about have always been willing, even anxious, to discard American justice and equity in exchange for the right to be the ones doing the persecuting. Their leaders have ridden that wave to unquestioned power, counting on "faith" to keep them in the best position to exploit their own people first, and the rest of us in their name second. These Christian Taliban are the greatest threat to America - greater than foreigners, greater than their current shepherds in the Republican Party. If they tempt the Democrats into their antiamerican agenda, then all is lost.
Re:Let the... (Score:3, Insightful)
A citizens divedend sounds like a good idea until you start doing the math on it. Primary problem is money. There are 300 Million people in the US. At $10k per person, that comes out to a total payout of $3 Trillion dollars. That is larger than the current US budget and is over a quarter of the US GDP.
Second problem I have with that, is that we are having the government take money from some people and giving other people money without having to do anything to earn it. I have a problem with that (even if I am the one getting hte money). Stealing from Peter to pay Paul and that kind of thing. If people want to help out others who are less fortunate, let them give their own money willingly without getting the government to handle it (and force others to give money). It's not that I have a problem with charity, It's that I have a problem with the government forcing me to as that is not charity.
One of the recognized problems with a citizens dividend (and welfare for that matter) is that you will have a certain percentage of the population who will become "surfers". (That's the persons term who wrote about this, not mine). This group would live off the "dividend" (if you can really call it that) without ever trying to get a job.
One last thing. You may actually increase the political battles over this. For one thing, about how to set the $10k, when to move it, who will have it taxable and many other things. Also, you may make people more reliant on the gov as employers will most likely factor this into their paycheck calculations among other things.
Follow that logic! (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Which way? (Score:3, Insightful)
I consider trumpeting states' rights on this issue akin to supporting states' rights for limitations on freedom of speech. It's a basic human right. The kind of thing the Constitution was designed to protect. And it's absolutely heinous that the government would try to take that right away from me.
Re:I can't wait to watch the fireworks. (Score:2, Insightful)
Tell me.
What part of the Conservative Philosophy includes:
- unlimited foreign immigration into the US.
- massive increases in deficit spending (largest in history).
- largest increase in size of the federal government in history.
- circumvention of judicial review for law enforcement.
- increased national dependence on foreign resources (oil) and finance (chinese-owned debt).
- violation of protection rules for classified national security information (Iraq war plans to Saudi Arabia, Sigint information to Iranian Intelligence via Ahmed Chalabi, other classified information to Israeli intelligence via AIPAC through civillian reps in the Pentagon (Feith, Wolfowitz, etc) and exposure of CIA agent's identity for purposes of political revenge.
- federal encroachment on state's rights (2000 presidential election, and recent decisions on Medical Marijuana).
George W Bush is no conservative.
He's nothing more than a power-hungry statist fascist.
That said - the Democrats have, indeed, already lost this battle. Bush gets to appoint whomever the hell he wants to, and there's not a damn thing anyone from the opposing party can do to stop it. No sense in whining about it now, that's for sure. This country DID elect Bush. And it deserves what Bush is about to do to it.
Re:This is MORE important than if Rehnquist left.. (Score:3, Insightful)
"Many think it not only inevitable but entirely proper that liberty give way to security in times of national crisis---that, at the extremes of military exigency, inter arma silent leges. Whatever the general merits of the view that war silences law or modulates its voice, that view has no place in the interpretation and application of a Constitution designed precisely to confront war and, in a manner that accords with democratic principles, to accommodate it." - Antonin Scalia, eviscerating the Bush administration's detention of terror suspects without charges or trials.
Re:Which way? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:The point of the judicial branch... (Score:2, Insightful)
Where does the Constitution say anything about contributory copyright infringement? Nowhere. As a result, SCOTUS must resort to interpretation of both the Constitution and extant law in order to figure out whether something qualifies as constitutional or not. There's a long road and two hundred forty years of law and history between "the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries" and "Corporations can be held liable if they promote copyright infringement via downloading."
Perhaps you could grace us with an answer to the Grokster question without relying on any document except the Constitution itself?
Re:Which way? (Score:2, Insightful)
I own a house. It's not all that nice of a house; for simplicity's sake, let's say it's been appraised at $100,000. However, it's been in the family for generations. My grandparents grew up in the house, and I love it dearly. But Uncle Sam doesn't like me having this house, because it's bringing down property values because it's so old, and it's in the middle of a nice, new development. I don't want to sell under any circumstances. Uncle Sam offers me $125,000, which would be more than a fair value if I were looking to sell, but I'm not. So Uncle Sam takes me to court, and the court rules that all ol' Uncle Sam has to give me is $100,000, and they can force me out of my house. I ask you, is that fair? More importantly, is that just? To me, the answer is obvious: No, that is not fair. No, that is not just. The government should not be given the right to buy property willy-nilly, without the consent of the owner. If I don't want to sell to Joe Blow from across town, why should I have to sell to the government? Why should the government take away my right to own my house? What business does the government have doing that?
Re:Great! (Score:4, Insightful)
The court is neither conservative nor liberal, it is primarily statist and authoritarian, as is most of our government right now.
Many liberals, including my self, were horrified at that ruling. Calling that ruling "liberal" merely shows that you have a deep failure to understand the term.
Re:With the recent close votes (Score:3, Insightful)
Nobody deserves respect. It has to be earned.
"Mr Bush has done as president, but he is my president, and as such deserves my respect."
You are in the minority. Other people resored to grilling about which orifice of Monica he stuck his cock into. Yes they point blank asked him if he stuck his cock into her mouth and her pussy (under oath!). Now that's what I call respect.
"What we really need is to get judges who stop trying to legislate from the bench, and return to applying law to the case, not writing law for a case."
Whoever Bush picks will be looking to make lots of new law. Bush wants somebody who will roll back roe V Wade, make sure fags never get married, roll back affarmitive action, and institute prayer in schools. He will be looking for somebody whose philosophically thinks the US should be a theocracy.
Re:The point of the judicial branch... (Score:2, Insightful)
Oh, that's easy.
Publishing is a direct exercise of speech, and is thus protected under the First Amendment. And so is advertising.
That means that any ruling against Grokster must meet very high standards. And so we move on to the copyright question.
The Constitution is very clear about copyright, patents, etc. The explicit and only reason for the existence of such protections is "To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts". And so, the test of whether or not any act is an affront to the clause in the Constitution that grants Congress the power to make laws that have the effect of "securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries" is whether or not the act in question impedes such progress.
Now, because the acts themselves in this case are protected by the First Amendment, the acts must clearly impede the progress of the sciences and the useful arts for them to be forbidden by law. It's not sufficient for the acts in question to be neutral with respect to that, because the acts are an exercise of one of the (if not the) most important rights we have.
What Grokster was doing doesn't clearly hinder the progress of the sciences and the useful arts. If it did, then it would be easy to show that it did. That what Grokster was doing would otherwise be protected under the First Amendment means that the plaintiff must show that Grokster's actions clearly impede the progress of the sciences and the useful arts. The plaintiff did not do so.
Hence, the decision of the Supreme Court very clearly should have been in Grokster's favor, based on nothing other than the Constitution and the stated intentions of those who wrote it.
Re:I'm going to burn some Karma (Score:1, Insightful)
BTW: I have been moderating and meta-moderating for years now. I already know that the "right" has plants at /. modding down anything that goes against current political policy. They have mod points and will "they" will mod me a troll.
It's good to see your tinfoil hat is working.
If your post was modded as a troll, I think it'd have less than a right wing conspiracy to control the hearts and minds of Slashdot (a largely foreign, liberal, and generally irrelevant readership) and more to do with the fact that your post is, in fact, a troll.