TXANG Debate Re-Igniting? 295
Last night, the Pentagon revealed that new records of President Bush's service in the Texas Air National Guard have been found, due to a FOIA request. This morning sees a New York Times column (free reg. req.), and a detailed "reexamination of the records" by the Boston Globe. Tonight, 60 Minutes II airs an interview with the man who got Bush into the Guard (though my TiVo says otherwise for some reason).
Re:The problem... (Score:2, Informative)
Holiday in Cambodia [msn.com], by Fred Kaplan:
Re:Blatantly political.... (Score:3, Informative)
The exclusion not working is a bug, it will be fixed. In the meantime, don't collpase sections.
Re:I think it matters, and here's why (Score:5, Informative)
Brainwashed by the republicans, are you? He never said he supported the war. He said he voted to give the president the authority to go to war, and he would do it again. I know, it's really hard to pay attention to little details like that when there are all kinds of shiny things around, but it's important, so try. If you read the text of the law that Kerry voted for, it's very explicit. It doesn't say "We vote to attack Iraq", it puts conditions under which the President is given the authority to attack Iraq.
Some of the more illuminating bits of this law include:
Re:Example of the problem with American politics. (Score:3, Informative)
Commanding officer doesn't remember signing a medal award? Wow, guess the 10,000 others must've confused him. The figure you're thinking of was at the theater level, not John Kerry's personal CO.
If you look at the stories of Kerry and whatziz name who was on the third boat, they match. Mine explodes, gunfire, ambush, shoot out, people getting pulled from water, etc.
The story that's divergent is Thurlow's and the SBVT's. Thurlow was IN THE RIVER for the entire engagement. He was fished out near the end
Also, they jab at Kerry over this ONE shoot out. Not, you know, all the other times he risked his life. Just one that was a mad house on water and an SBVT was actually at, unlike the rest of the SBVTs who, as Jon Stewart pointed out, "served" with Kerry just as Bob Dole "served" with Generals Patton or Montgomery. Sure they were in the same war, but they weren't exactly next to each other.(Though didn't Dole get wounded in Sicily?)
The SBVTs are a tool of the Bush admin ala Willy Horton and "Rock us!" Dukakis. Maybe not in the same office, but definitely trading resources. That's so far from kosher it's comparable to a pork and crab po'boy.
Now, the issue with the records is just silly. You really want his KP reports and an inventory of how many socks he was issued? Who cares? The commendations are out for everyone at the event in question. They all line up pretty well. They were never questioned until the SBVTs decided that they were no good soldiers who lied and acted cowardly, but ya know, with John Kerry, 'cause he was like, totally there...in Vietnam...on the other side of the country...
Re:Does this matter? (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Does this matter? (Score:2, Informative)
Kerry didn't admit to commiting war crimes... The stories he relating to the Senete Committee where related to him. Guilty of hear-say? Yes. Guilty of war crimes? No...
Re:I think it matters, and here's why (Score:3, Informative)
Yea, right. It's amazing you people believe this BS.
Two hundred and fifty of THESE GUYS [billingsgazette.com].
Columbus swift boat vet angry about letter
By LINDA HALSTEAD-ACHARYA
Of The Gazette Staff
COLUMBUS - Swift boat veteran Bob Anderson of Columbus is ticked.
It bothers him that Sen. John Kerry's swift boat history has become such a political hot potato. But he's even more irritated that his name was included - without his permission - on a letter used to discredit Kerry.
"I'm pretty nonpolitical," the 56-year-old Anderson said Tuesday. So, when he found out last week that his name was one of about 300 signed on a letter questioning Kerry's service, he was "flabbergasted."
"It's kind of like stealing my identity," said Anderson, who spent a year on a swift boat as an engine man and gunner.
The letter, which was posted on the Swift Boat Veter-ans for Truth Web site, claims the Demo-cratic presidential candidate has "grossly and knowingly distorted the conduct of the American soldiers, marines, sailors and airmen of that (Vietnam) war."
The letter also criticizes Kerry for trying to change his image from a critic of the war to a war hero.
"After reading the letter," Anderson said, "it kind of got under my skin. I had never come across a situation where someone used my name without my support or approval. It's not a very comforting feeling."
What's worse, he said, he disagrees with the letter.
"Had they asked me to use my name, I wouldn't have allowed them to," he said.
Anderson, a 1966 graduate of Chinook High School, describes himself as a naive Montana kid who was smacked by the reality of war soon after arriving in Vietnam in 1967.
"It's not a very pleasant way to grow up," he said.
He served on a swift boat about the same time Kerry did. However, the first time he met Kerry was during a reunion of swift boat vets in Norfolk, Va., in March 2003.
Anderson said he cannot dispute or verify Kerry's experience. In fact, he's forgotten much of his own.
"You remember the simple things," he said. "The rest is what you don't want to remember."
He does, however, support Kerry's right to state his opinion.
"We say we're protecting democracy. That's why we go to war. As Americans, we can have our opinions, right?"
Anderson can vividly recall the last day of 1969, when his boat was attacked.
"The thing I remember before we got hit was the grass dragging on the sides of the boat - the canals were so narrow," he said. "I can also remember the smell of napalm."
Anderson's boat was about the fourth boat back in a string of 10. He describes the scene as an Armageddon. Fellow swift boat sailor Bob Wedge was so badly wounded, Anderson doubted he would survive.
"That boat was like a slaughterhouse that day," he said. "He (Wedge) just about bled to death before we got a tourniquet on him and the chopper got him."
Wedge, who lost a leg, was flown home. Thirty-four years passed before the two met again. Now they find themselves on the same side of another conflict.
Wedge, 60, of Mesquite, Nev., said his name, too, was on the list - and he's mad.
"This is the fourth or fifth time someone has called me or e-mailed me in regard to signing this damn letter," he wrote in an e-mail to Anderson. "I don't agree with it and want no part of it and especially don't want my name on it."
Both men have tried to contact the Swift Boat Ve
Re:Does this matter? (Score:5, Informative)
2) Are you aware that several of the people who knowingly signed the list later retracted, saying they didn't read it well first?
3) Are you aware that the very medals that the leader of this group has were due to being awarded them for heroism under fire in the same situation Kerry was in? And that several leaders in the group are on record previously praising Kerry for his heroism - sometimes even recently?
4) Are you aware that essentially every navy document from the time, including even the damage reports from the boats (which had bullet holes) has backed up Kerry's side?
5) Are you aware that of the people who actually *Served With* Kerry on his boat, all but one have voiced support for him (and that one is dead), and that of the surviving members, all but one are campaigning with him (and that one supports him nonetheless)?
6) Are you aware that the doctor who claims to have treated Kerry's wounds wasn't the one listed on the documentation as having treated Kerry, and that the doctor who did treat him affirmed Kerry's report of the wound?
Need I go on? There were only a handful of boats even present on the day, so your "254" number is just ludicrous. They "served with him" in the fact that they were in vietnam on swift boats at the same time that he was in vietnam on a swift boat. But even most damning is the fact that the head of this group was also in charge of several other smear campaigns in the past, including one against McCain (undoubtedly one of the reasons why McCain has come down so firmly against these ads).
About all that I can say that's good about them, is at least it's not the same people who did the "McCain fathered a black child!" race-baiting smear.
Re:Does this matter? (Score:3, Informative)
2. http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/0
3. http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A13267-2
http://www.factcheck.or
http://www.factcheck.org/UploadedFi
http://www.iht.com/articles/534905.html
4. http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/nation/95
5. Have you seriously never heard of his "band of brothers"? I was just referring to the crew of his who was on at the time when Rassmann was rescued (incl. Rassmann himself); overall, he's campaigned with 12 vets that were on his boats (a good portion of the total).
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A
6) http://www.factcheck.org/MiscReports.aspx?docID=2
Additional:
http://mediamatters.org/items/printable/2004080
http://www.dailyhowler.com/dh083004.shtml
Re:For those too lazy to read the article... (Score:3, Informative)
I let my flight medical lapse after I ran out of money for flying. Since that's not the case with a military man, I have to question - Why would a pilot in the Air National Guard let the most basic requirement for flight lapse unless he were simply not going to do the job?
He wasn't lazy - he willfully terminated the #1 requirement of the job.
Professional pilots today take out INSURANCE policies against losing their Flight Medicals. A missed medical grounds you instantly and immediately.