Hackers Take Aim at Republicans 1866
An anonymous reader writes "Wired reports-- Online protests targeting GOP websites could turn out to be more than symbolic during this month's Republican National Convention, possibly blocking a critical communications tool for the party... "We want to bombard (the Republican sites) with so much traffic that nobody can get in," said CrimethInc, a member of the so-called Black Hat Hackers Bloc. It's one of several groups planning to distribute software tools to reload Republican sites over and over again."
Re:Bound to happen (Score:1, Interesting)
Disagree (Score:1, Interesting)
SPIN! (Score:2, Interesting)
CrimethInc (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Why isn't this YRO? (Score:2, Interesting)
1. there are other outlets for them to let their voice be heard.
2. they could increase server capacity
3. how is there not a plugin for apache that will detect a IP address/set of IP addresses/location of machine so that if it consistently loads the same page (ex
ridiculous; nothing more than childish vandalism (Score:3, Interesting)
And not all "hackers" are anti-Bush btw.
Re:The whole idea is crazy (Score:2, Interesting)
Reloading a page isn't illegal.
Bogging a site down due to page loads isn't illegal. If it were, we wouldn't be having this discussion because Slashdot wouldn't exist...
Now, if they try to crack into the servers and, for example, download the donor databases and start using those credit card numbers to purchase insanely large amounts of Kraft marshmallows to throw at Bush on the campaign trail, then that would be illegal (except for the part about purchasing marshmallows... if they used their own money, that is).
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:5, Interesting)
Then we have to deal with average people joining the Republican party just because it offers a sane choice compared to the nutjob left wingers. Hell, even crazies like Anne Coulter seem sane compared to hacker groups actively working to break the law in the name of democracy.
For years I was afraid to even admit I was a liberal. Not because I was embarrassed to care about progressive goals, but because I had to deal with being associated with misguided wierdos like these. I wish there was a t-shirt..."I'm against Bush but I don't want to kill him or take down his server or rage about how he's a filthy liar. I just want people not to vote for him because he hasn't done a very good job."
Re:Bound to happen (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:4, Interesting)
"We need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime. We all know the litany of his offenses. He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation.
Other Kerry quotes of interest... [davidstuff.com]
Re:Silly hackers! (Score:4, Interesting)
Now now now....
They're not stupid. They just stopped advancing technologically, socially, and politically around the same time fire was discovered.
Compare and contrast that with the Democrats. They're willing to jump on, over, and under any random bandwagon that happens to come along in the technological, social, or political field.
Since the independents and libertarians are usually the ones driving the bandwagons, and they're so scatterbrained and disorganized that the wagon is all over the road and running down everyone else in the field, we can't really look to them for any clarity either.
The moral of this story is that they're all stupid, and people should just try thinking for themselves for a change.
Of course.... most people are stupid..... so....
shocking (Score:2, Interesting)
I don't care if we do not find WMD's. Sadaam had plenty of time to destroy/hide them. We know he had them in the past and that he would use them. He needed to go (as well as many other dictators in this world too that i'm ashamed we havn't dealt with yet).
This moderate is voting right this year. I'm not going to betray people that we said we would free.
(don't pull the well Bush betrayed the US B.S. I've heard it a thousand times and I've seen Mr. Moore's 'movie' "which made me even more upset with the left")
And when they get caught... (Score:3, Interesting)
Im not a huge George W. fan, I dont like his views on immigration, IMO he isn't a true reagan conservative which is what we need.
Kerry on the other hand is either a liar or a war criminal- "I personally didn't see personal atrocities in the sense I saw somebody cut a head off or something like that," Kerry said. "However, I did take part in free-fire zones, I did take part in harassment and interdiction fire, I did take part in search-and-destroy missions in which the houses of noncombatants were burned to the ground. And all of these acts, I find out later on, are contrary to the Hague and Geneva conventions and to the laws of warfare. So in that sense, anybody who took part in those, if you carry out the application of the Nuremberg Principles, is in fact guilty." - John Kerry Source Included,I hate facts pulled from no where [boston.com]
Did he do those things? I dont know. But either he did and he is a war criminal, or he didnt and he's a liar. It's one or the other. Living in rhode island with a fiance in MA, I see what Kerry is like up close. He doesnt do much. I just wouldnt trust him with the keys to the country.
Re:Giving the GOP a giant gift (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Well... (Score:5, Interesting)
I figure I should probably answer your comment about making the middle east less of a hotbed of extremism. In the late 1800's, germany wanted an African Colony. It had finally become a unified country, and was begining to flex it's muscles. But in the process of taking that African Colony, it managed to cause France and England to ally themselves together. Now, we tend to think of france and england as friends now, but back then, they had just been through 500 years of war(give or take). So it was a big deal to get these two countries to put aside their differences and join forces.
The same thing is happening now to the US. We are turning many of our NATO allies against us, and many of our allies from other parts of the world. They are just as important, if not more so in combating the old problem of anti-american extremism. The problem is, the world is not broken into two halves anymore, since the end of the cold war, and the US is not the superpower it once thought it was. I worry that Bush is isolating us from the rest of the world with his tough talk. Tough talk is necessary sometimes, but are we actually able to back it up?
The current situation in Iraq seems to imply that we can't.
Re:Morals and Democrats (Score:2, Interesting)
Here [hillnews.com] is a little knowledge for you. It's not exactly the same, but it's the same idea.
cyber terrorism? (Score:1, Interesting)
This is either really naive or really deceptive, however I tend to think its the latter:
If anybody is so stupid to listen to these script kiddies, they deserve to end up in jail. People like this give hackers a bad name.
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:3, Interesting)
I see what you are saying and it definatly does look harmless and almost like a prank. The problem really lies within the intent of the action wich can easily elevate it into somethign else. Reloading a page is inocent, reloading a page so fast you are trying to disrup services is not. Reloading a page so fast as to disrupt services in concert with others to make sure you achive your goal really sounds like criminal intent.
What is going to be funny is when everyone that participated wakes up next month to find thier credit cards have been use to buy somethign in russia. Or thier ISP telles them to stop sending spam, or even better their anti virus all the sudden decides to report viruses that were installed because the reload script downloaded trojans or somethign durring the flood.
Wouldn't this be really funny if this is just a trick to get alot of people to install a spam relay and the reload script has a vulnerability in it allowing mass conections and owner ship of the computer being run on? After this day, your internet conection would be nothign more then a spam rellay or some owned node in a hacking or kiddy porn hosting job. I wonder if the reload script is open source?
Re:Take off your... (Score:2, Interesting)
I totally agree. The only way to tackle problems like that are with money. Now, where's the money gonna come from. The U.S. can't give "pay off" every third-world country to keep impoverished and ill-educated people from forming terroristic type societies. The arab world itself has shown no interest in spending the trillions of dollars that it has in trying to help. So, what solution?
Personally, I feel that the old "give a man a fish/teach a man to fish" saw applies. That means a capitalist society, and that will, unfortunately mean a regime change in a lot of places.
The current situation sucks, but I'm hopeful that something good will come out of Iraq. Like this could be the first domino that knocks over the whole region.
It's not that the arab culture should be destroyed and made "westernized", but that it should at least be "modernized". (For those that find this arrogant, please notice that I say that in the least arrogant way possible. Keeping your women uneducated is an example of a backward element of arab culture. There are many others.)
My $0.02
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:5, Interesting)
I am Spanish. What's funny about this is that the Spanish people reacted not out of fear but anger. Ask any Spaniard you meet - did you vote because you were afraid of another attack? (Kiss Bush's)Assnar served only George Bush's agenda, and put Spanish troops in Iraq despite over 90% of the population opposing the war. The fact is that he made our country less safe by allowing the Spanish military to be led by GWB, and we were tired of a president who acted the way the president of the US wanted, not the people of Spain.
And if you're a marine, aren't you concerned about the fact that GWB never served his country?
Yes (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Take off your... (Score:3, Interesting)
All of the roots of the current Iraq fiasco involve the NATO powers and the Muslim world.
During the Cold War, our strategy was to oppose Soviet incursions (direct or indirect) by supporting and arming those who we believed opposed our enemy. While the strategy worked in some ways, it had other very nasty side effects, among them the fact that these West-hating fundamentalists and other Arab equivalents of black-helicopter militias have easier access to weapons than they might otherwise have had. The fact that Iraq is ready to disintegrate into its component ethnic enclaves goes right back to its creation as a state in 1921 [timesdispatch.com]. As you correctly say, al-Qaeda owes its existence to deep-pocketed Saudi oil barons funded by the world's love of cheap energy.
As for your charges that the was some great corruption scandal in the UN oil-for-food program, note that these charges are based on documents held by Ahmed Chalabi (who is wanted by both Jordan and the Iraqi provisional government for various kinds of fraud). Chalabi has refused to show these documents to any outsiders, including the press. They're about as reliable as the pictures of mobile bioweapons labs shown to the UN.
Something else that
follows right along with this. The threat that Iraq or al-Qaeda would be able to launch ICBM attacks or drop a Fat Man type weapon on the US or Europe is vanishingly small. Technically what politicians are calling "mass destruction" means 1000-5000 people dead and a lot of mayhem and fear. The real, on-the-ground threat was that Saddam armed with regional-scale nukes could well have launched a regional war that would have brought world oil production to a screeching halt. This is a serious threat, but it's hard to see how knocking out Saddam without a clear plan towards stability made any progress towards mitigating that risk.
We should be taking a variety of measures to stop threats from terrorists (including a lot more work securing ports and the electrical grid), but the notion that baddies can build a nuke in their basement is pretty ridiculous.
Re:Take off your... (Score:3, Interesting)
There are over 740 tons of Sarin alone unaccounted for...
Okay, let's do some math here. How do you transport 740 tons of Sarin out of the country without being noticed? Remember, we can track individual trucks by satellite. So:
Sarin is a gas. But let's ignore that, and suppose that it's a liquid and can be easily transported in drums. A military truck could load perhaps 2 tons of barrels.
740 / 2 = 370 truck loads would have had to cross the Iraqi border in order for Saddam to have completely eliminated his Sarin stash before the war.
How is it that we picked up individual "chemical weapon lab" trucks on satellite, but missed the 370 trucks moving across the border? If they were spaced only 150 feet apart, the convoy would have stretched for more than ten miles! How did we miss that?
But Sarin is not a liquid. As a gas, its density is far lower than that of liquid, and to put 2 tons of gas in compressed cylinders on a military truck would be quite a feat. Even if the weight of the delivery vehicle (shell, bomb, etc...) was included in those 740 tons, it's still iffy. 740 tons of 100 lb artillery shells is 14,800 rounds. At 100 rounds/truck, you're still looking at 148 vehicles.
How did we miss that?
Or, maybe he really didn't have any "WMD".
Saddam Hussein may certainly have been very evil. But his "crime" was not his oppression of people, but rather that he tried too hard to be like the U.S. - a sovereign nation possessing weapons of strategic deterrence.
Lives have actually been saved (Score:5, Interesting)
Funny how, pre-Iraq-war, virtually the same crowd of people was vehemently opposed to sanctions in Iraq, due to its detrimental effect on the people of Iraq, while having virtually no effect on the leadership; indeed, effectively strengthening Hussein's power.
So now, what of these 600,000-some dead Iraqi people under sanctions? That approximately 50,000 a year, the number we were always bombarded with during the tired "no blood for oil" protest of the 90s?
Well, here's some numbers for you:
Since March of 2003, *including* the 10000-15000 Iraqis US and coalition forces are estimated to have killed during the invasion, there has actually been a NET PRESERVATION of Iraqi lives, on the order of the thousands. A statistically significant PRESERVATION of Iraqi lives, all from the relatively minimal infrastructure and services improvements made by coalition forces since March 2003. That's how little Saddam cared for his own people, without regard to sanctions. No matter your position on the Iraq war, our direct action has saved, and will continue to save, THOUSANDS of lives of innocent Iraqis. Remember: the only alternative course of action was continuing sanctions. Even the radical idea of lifting sanctions wouldn't have changed Saddam's focus from only concentrating services and resources on Baghdad, leaving over 50% of the population to suffer and fend for itself, not to mention that France, Germany, and Russia would never have allowed the lifting of sanctions, short of military action (which we took). Think about that: exclusively because of US action, statistically, thousands of Iraqis have lived, who otherwise wouldn't have. Countless thousands of others will enjoy this same future, to say nothing of access to basic amenities of life previously not available to rural areas.
This of course, ignores the whole concept that sometimes it's necessary to take lives to save far more. Sometimes I wonder if the US is the same country that effectively fought WWII...
Re:Anarchists and Republicans (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Well... (Score:5, Interesting)
I'd suggest that radical Islam plays a similar role in the middle east. It provides an ideological and cultural counterpoint to an invasive foreign system. Not only has the western world colonized the rest of the world on an economic and cultural level, the US is now recolonizing the middle east on a physical level too.
Wow. (Score:5, Interesting)
First, let's talk about references. When I say something like x is due to y, I like to back it up with something like according to z(www.z.com), you get the picture.
Now the "Germany KNOWS that Saddam did have WMD" statement sounds a little overstated - I would assume you are referring to international findings of that nature and not the Germans in particular?
On that note, almost every country has WMD right now. [fas.org] I think that makes the WMD case for war a bit daft, but that's just a personal opinion.
I'm at a bit of a loss on this statement:
"Are we to believe that in the interim period, Iraq secretly destroyed all of its remaining weapons, on its own, with no supervision or involvement of outside monitors, all with no proof or records"
Let's try CNN [cnn.com] on this one. Looks like they were destroying them right up to the war.
Here's another idea I take issue with:
"it's not just about bombing people into oblivion; it's about encouraging free government with a free flow of information"
The question I have here is why, after over a year, have we still seen none of this come to fruition? Sure, we handed over power [thestar.com], but to an unelected government that we selected. Also, how did we contribute to the free flow of information by banning newspapers? [theage.com.au]
You go on to insist that this was somehow was positive for "most of the civilized world", but offer no rational for that logic. I think it's much safer to assume that the real winners here are defence contractors [yahoo.com] tied to the Whitehouse [cbsnews.com]
"People think that the US just wants to arrogantly steamroll people..." Please don't talk about the actions of the state as the actions of the US. I'm a part of this great country, and like many others [votetoimpeach.org], I consider this war a shameful crime against humanity.
Deny free speech. It's the Democratic party way. (Score:1, Interesting)
Take Rush Limbaugh off armed forces radio...
Get Sean Hannity off the air.
Hey, if you don't like what they're saying, just shut them up, right?
Sweet, Sweet Karma (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:5, Interesting)
Wait though, the whole Alien hive mentality is fairly similar to conservative right-wing corporate America. And it appeared that the Predators had a somewhat progressive agenda, even giving up on a thousands year old tradition for the sake of the common good.
Crap, you've got my mind all wondering which side fits in with my own agenda, being a part of a crack team of Antarctict archeologists and all.
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:3, Interesting)
From the WFB:
Argentina purchasing power parity - $432.7 billion (2003 est.), external debt $142 billion (2002 est.)
USA purchasing power parity - $10.98 trillion (2003 est.), external debt $1.4 trillion (2001 est.)
I'd say that pretty much sums it up...
Re:Anarchists and Republicans (Score:4, Interesting)
Seriously, though, Bush's attitude is "my way or the highway." This even has some Republicans bristling. Take John McCain for istance. The Democrats are trying to position themselves as the party of inclusion, a party big enough and strong enough for a variety of viewpoints. Most of this is because they had to field a candidate and the Republicans' role is now to march in lock-step with whatever Bush (by which I mean Karl Rove) trots out.
A LOT of Republicans are wondering what happened to fiscal repsonsibility. But you don't hear much about it. It's much safer to attack the external target -- the Democrats than to question the policies of our Great Leader, or the internal workings of your own party.
Re:The whole idea is crazy (Score:3, Interesting)
Bad anology. Better, this is akin to going to a Presidential address in Ohio and speaking and making your views heard. Which DID get someone arrested DURING this administration.
If the republican party is incapable of handling bandwidth they should do something about it. In my opinion this is a legitimate form (though in bad taste because it does evoke free speech issues) of protest. I guarantee the democrats couldn't take down MS or hell
BTW, which site are they going to do this to. Some of us on
Re:Take off your... (Score:2, Interesting)
Complete and utter bullshit.
Exports to Iraq 1st half of 2002: 220 milion.
Total german annual exports: >$700 BILLION.
Tell me, does that look like enough money to raise a stink with a major ally? Answer: no. Also you're not making any sense. If it was about money Germany would have taken part in the war. Contracts to be gained were certainly greater than those pre-war peanuts.
Saddam and or his sons would have eventually gained WMD and used them against the U.S.A. and or Isreal.
That doesn't make any sense, he would have been wiped out by the retaliation.
Re:So much for... (Score:2, Interesting)
I doubt this will be a very effective tactic but I think its their prerogative to try it as long as they don't do anything illegal.
I think the important thing to point out is how misplaced all the cries here are about intolerance and depriving the Republican's of their free speech. The Republican's have done far mor violence to free speech, open mindedness and tolerance than anyone in my lifetime though Hoover and Nixon were a close second. You'd have to go back to McCarthyism to match or top them. I should point out McCarthyism sprung in to existence the last time the Republican's had control of Congress and we aren't far from it now that they have power again. There is something about Republicans, when they have power, that drives them to intolerance and viciousness.
It should be pointed out that its been the right of American's to go to party conventions, carry signs and engage in non violent protest as long as I can remember, it was proof of how strong our democracy was, until this year of course. This year I defy you to engage in an unauthorized, nonviolent protest at either of the conventions. There was only one march that was allowed at the DNC, and it was the day before the convention, the police out numbered the protesters and it got almost no media coverage. I recall one attempt at an unauthorized protest, it also got no coverage and I wager the police shut it down instantly.
During the DNC if you wanted to protest you were put in a razor wire cage, euphemistcly called a "free speech zone", out of sight, out of mind and you were no doubt ID'ed and cataloged. I don't recall a single second of media coverage of any protestors actually stupid enough to subject themselves to it, though there were numerous clips of the empty cage. I imagine the same will hold true at the RNC and more so.
Aiming your indignation at Crimethics is misplaced little campaign is pretty lame when its compared to the harm being done to free speech and the right to protest by the Department of Homeland security with the blessing of both parties.
I recall a speech Bush gave in Minnesota a week or two ago in a quarry. A couple young guys managed to get tickets, you had to have tickets to see the President speak and they were supposed to be handed out only to the Bush faithful. One of them wore an antibush T shirt under another shirt. Well the secret service spotted it and the two were nearly arrested. The Secret Service apparently backed off realizing they hadn't actually done anything illegal. They were detained for the duration and had the opportunity to watch the speech accompanied by the Secret Service, and I assure you they are cataloged in the SS and FBI files now.
I assure we have a lot bigger issues with free speech and nonviolent protest than Crimethics silly little campaign. In fact I defy you to ever get within sight of the President carrying any kind of anti Bush sign. You will either be shunted to a "free speech zone" out of sight, detained by the Secret Service or out right arrested.
I just really wouldn't shed a tear about this Republican group's "free speech". They are the same group who smeared John McCain in the 2000 primaries using racist and sexual innuendo about his adopted Bangladesh child. I've lost some faith in McCain that he is endorsing Bush this year after the vicious stuff they did to him in 2000. Rumor is he's been promised Secretary of Defense as his payoff. I'd like to see him there to straighten out the Pentagon but I wager the Bush team conned him with the promise and will renege if the the time comes.
Karl Rove in his
Re:Not unexpected (Score:3, Interesting)
Yeah, the so-called 'liberal' WP and NYT are just now coming out with investigations (see the NYT ombudsman, and WP's Howard Kurtz) about how their own editors burried stories questioning the administration's WMD claims, while writing blaring headlines about how Saddam was on the verge of bringing down a WMD apocalypse upon the US whenever Bush, Cheney, et al. made such a declaration.
I'd hate to see what a conservative press looks like if the NYT and WP have a liberal bias in their news stories (remember, there's a church-state firewall between news and editorials in these organizations). I'm sure they'd claim that they report and we decide
Question / Suggestion: (Score:2, Interesting)
Why do so? If you agree with the RNC, then because you agree with them. If you don't, then thinking along the lines of, "I don't agree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to say it," would be the impetus.
Would the RNC accept help from fair minded netizens (yeah, I still like that word)? Would /.ers offer?
Re:Bound to happen (Score:3, Interesting)
But fine, if we want to play that game...
The wack jobs that bomb abortion clinics are a glowing indication of the inability of the right to address problems without resorting to bombs!
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:4, Interesting)
The truth is that hundreds of civilians and many a soldier from Spain have died because we supported the US, however not a single US solider has ever died for supporting Spain. And with "thankful" comments like the ones uttered by the previous poster, I sincerelly hope not a single drop of Spanish blood is ever wasted for America ever again.
For a preson coming from a country than one hundred years ago declared war on us, and than fifty years ago decided to starve us to death you certainly have some brass balls asking our soldiers to die for your comfy little behind.
Next time you go and pick up the gun and you get your butt over there... is this what the "land of the brave, home of the free" has de-evolved into? "better to have never served at all" LOL!
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:2, Interesting)
Also you calling the iraq war, an ilegal war. Well here is another unsuported liberal fan fair. There is nothing ilegal about it. You say he lied about going to war, were did bush lie? There is nothing he has said that was a lie. There has been inteligence reports (that every one including John kerry from the senate inteligence comity) belived to be true that is questionable or found to be not true today but thats not a lie is it?
As far as freedoms being striped away? some argue that clinton did just as much with the DMCA that kerry supported but who is keeping count. we are talking about the lessor of 2 evils not comparing a sun of a bitch to some angelic asshat.
I'm waiting to hear what you say bush lied about. I don't think you cand find a legitamit outrite lie he has said. but if you can then post it so i can see it.
Now you speak of a tax surplus that doesn't exist todyay. Well if you were above a morons inteligence you would know that the buget surplus was gone when clinton was in office and the surplus was fake to begin with. I'm not saying it didn't exist, i'm saying the reasons it existed cannot and didn't sustain past the one or two years it had happend. The reason for this? clinton offered the roth ira and a conversion from regular ira plans that allow people to pay taxes when converting over a four year scheme. This extra tax that should have been colected when the holders are retired and withdrew income was instead colected in a lump sum when it wasn't expected to be. Also clinton decreased (gasp clinton gave a tax cut!) the capitol gains taxes from almost 40% to 15 percent or your anualy income tax percentage rate depending on how much it was if you held the investment over a year. This inspired alot of people to sell holdings they have been waiting on for years and created a increased tax flow that would not be sustainable in the long term.
Further more i think you are misunderstanding what the tax surplus was. It doesn't mean we had paid of our debt and had money left over. It only mean we spent less money in one physcal year then we have budgeted to spend. Once the extra tax revenue was gone so is the budget surplus. Clinton lost this surplus in his last year in office like his ecomemy went into the tanks and people want to blame that one bush too. It is widly known that the econemy is in as good of or better shape then when Bush took office.
Now finally, somethign that really iritates me when stupid "i hate bush" dumbass cock jockeys go around and claim that bush is only lining the pockets of his cronies (haliburten) Why don't you rethink that and call them clintons cronies. After all clinton is the one that gave them the contract (and john kerry as well as other senators voted for it too) that allows haliburton to go into government contract situation without an open bid process. Yes, thats right, the choice to use haliburton in iraq was clintons doings. Halibuton was contracting with the government since before reagon was president. as a reward for this contract services under clintons watch, halibuton was awarded a open contract to perform work at the lowest bid before an open bid proccess could take place. What this means is, If somethign needs done and it need to be done right now, they call halibuton to start it. Then they do the open bidding that normal government contracts enjoy. After the lowest bid is excepted, halibuton only gets paid what person actually getting the job gets. In some cases halibuton os the lowest bidder or actually the best person for the job and get the job. This has been going on since before bush was even in office and nothign has changed. If anythign bush is lining the pockets of clinton's cronies.
Why your searching for some truth try pulling your head out of your ass and looking at the facts. Also spell checking leave clowns liek you with nothign legit to complain about.
Re:The whole idea is crazy (Score:2, Interesting)
In effect, they are trying to recreate the /. effect. Does this mean /. is illegal?
Re:If I was american... (Score:2, Interesting)
Interesting that in 1992 it wasnt important to John Kerry that Bill Clinton didnt serve in vietnam, saying "we all served in many different ways". [msn.com]
Also, Bush is not a liar. I can only pressume you are talking about the WMD in iraq. Please note, if Bush lied when he said that Iraq had WMD's, then you are also saying that Saddam Hussain, Kofi Annon, Bill Clinton, Al Gore, Madylin Albright and more lied about it as well. You cant play a game of pin the tail on the incumbant here. There is also an AP News story about "things" being trucked into Syria [washingtontimes.com].
I just am not a fan of rhetoric. The summation of arguments agaist Bush is... He is stupid, He is a Liar, and HALIBURTON!. Oh yeah, and he's AWOL. While it is hard to find evidence about one's intelligence, he did graduate from Yale and is the President. Most stupid people dont accomplish that. I already cited sufficiently, I believe, why Bush is not a liar. As for HALLIBURTON!, I can only say it is a big american company that helps our military in certain situations. It has been used by Bush 1, Clinton, and Bush 2. Maybe people dont like they idea of such a big company, but... there arent exactly Mom and Pop small-buisnesses that can provide high octane fuel to bases in Basra.
Just my 2, well, maybe 3 cents.
Re:Not unexpected (Score:3, Interesting)
I wish it were a big threat. But the tactic of the major parties when confronted by a third party that has some momentum is to try to flatten their tires by proclaiming that, for example, "a vote for Nader is a vote for Bush". Instead of trying to engage the people who want to vote for a third-party candidate in order to bring them around, the major parties use scare tactics to bludgeon the vote out of third-party supporters.
Do you think this is going to win votes for Kerry? (Score:3, Interesting)
What a waste (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Not unexpected (Score:3, Interesting)
True. Convincing voters to vote their fears and hate instead of their desires and dreams seems to be a point of conduct in our system. But it's still a fight worth waging. All the more since the Republicans and Democrats aren't interested in listening to the third party voice but rather trying to silence it.
Yes, solidly secular. (Score:1, Interesting)
So much for Democracy. (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:3, Interesting)
By the way, the parent's numbers seem to come from the CIA World Factbook [cia.gov].
Re:Myth (Score:2, Interesting)
The Democrats are STILL pro-slavery! They just call it "welfare" these days.
...so you're saying welfare should be abolished? And by your logic, those people would be better off? That seems a little nonsensical.
Re:Take off your... (Score:3, Interesting)
Page 61 of the report says:
Using your definition of "contact" and "connection" Donald Rumsfeld himself [gwu.edu] is clearly in on the putative al Qaeda-Iraq network formed from these "contacts" and "connections".
If you met with someone who slept with my wife and perhaps even discussed infidelity, would I have have cause to attack you because of the "connection" between you and the adulterer?
Not that I think that there weren't legitimate reasons for a well-planned attack on Saddam, but I hate this use of vague language to avoid having to a call a spade a spade: we attacked Saddam Hussein because we didn't like what he was doing in Iraq. It didn't have the slightest bit to do with any realistic threats to the US.
Re:This is being done by Republican-SUPPORTERS, ri (Score:2, Interesting)
Aren't you forgetting that little skirmish called the Spanish Civil War which kept Spain out of that little skirmish called World War II?
Re:An Image of Anarchy (Score:3, Interesting)
Comment removed (Score:3, Interesting)