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Cheyenne Mountain Shutting Down

Posted by Zonk on Sun Jul 30, 2006 12:32 PM
from the stargate-shut-down dept.
Government Space United States Politics Technology
WilliamSChips writes "The United States military has announced that they are shutting down the facility at Cheyenne Mountain, home to the high-tech NORAD which tracks every object in the sky. NORAD's operations will be moved to the nearby Peterson Air Force base. The mountain facility is being placed on standby in case they need it again." From the article: "The Cheyenne Mountain center, at the eastern foot of the Rockies near the base of Pikes Peak, was constructed underground in the mid-1960s. Fearing nuclear attacks at the time, the United States built sites such as the Cheyenne Mountain complex. The Navy prepared a floating White House aboard the communications cruiser USS Northampton, in case the president needed to be evacuated from U.S. soil. Another protective bunker was created near White Sulphur Springs, W.Va., for members of Congress."
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[+] Santa Meets NORAD, Tux Gets Lit Up For Xmas 142 comments
runlvl0 writes "Once again, NORAD is tracking Santa Claus on his annual trip around the world via the NORAD Tracks Santa website. Oddly, as of 1900 GMT, Santa is taking a spin over the Persian Gulf. I guess that he's glad not to have to worry about "no-fly zones" this year." NORAD has been keeping an eye on our favorite present deliverer for a few years now. Elsewhere, pixelbeat writes "Michael Still created a lovely Tux in Xmas tree lights. The complete process from gimp to the final 707 lights was documented."
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  • The stargate program is being expanded...

    Simon

  • Auction! (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 30 2006, @12:34PM (#15811975)
    Let's put it up for auction! This would be a really cool geek house. It would be even better than living in an old missile silo!
          • I do know that law enforcement has a problem with fortified houses and bunkers. They're illegal in lots of places.
            This is, unfortunately, absolutely true. Let's hear it for "proactive policing"! Naturally these laws are only meant to give our beloved law enforcers the leverage necessary to keep all those nasty bikers from building forts in otherwise peaceful neighborhoods. Never mind the fact that it's now essentially illegal in many places to build a house too sturdy to break into, or in some cases even own a house built in the 50's with ATOMIC WAR in mind. No, it's more important for the fat, lazy cops to be able to simply arrest "violent bikers" for bricking up their downstairs windows than to actually catch them in the act of being violent.

  • Santa (Score:5, Funny)

    by RealSurreal (620564) * on Sunday July 30 2006, @12:36PM (#15811988)
    I hope they're taking the Santa tracking equipment with them!

    • Re:Santa (Score:5, Informative)

      by jdbartlett (941012) on Sunday July 30 2006, @12:42PM (#15812028)
      Never ye fear:
      "Cheyenne Mountain is not going away," Keating told reporters Friday. "There will be a small number of people that will remain at Cheyenne Mountain to maintain the facility in the event we need to stand up for either a real world threat or for exercises. Day-to-day NORAD-North Com operations will occur from Peterson Air Force Base."

  • Quote from General Moe (Score:4, Funny)

    by jdbartlett (941012) on Sunday July 30 2006, @12:38PM (#15812000)
    "Let's go burn down the observatory so this never happens again!"

  • Telephone number (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday July 30 2006, @12:44PM (#15812042)
    Will WOPR have the same phone number if it's moved too?

  • Would you like to play a game? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Weaselmancer (533834) on Sunday July 30 2006, @12:46PM (#15812056)

    Maybe now we can take time out to port Linux to the WOPR. [wikipedia.org] How about a nice game of GnuChess?

  • It looks like Ill have to find a new place to play bridge, poker, checkers, tic-tac-toe, chess, and global thermonuclear war.

  • SkyNet online (Score:5, Funny)

    by tprox (621523) on Sunday July 30 2006, @12:51PM (#15812079)
    They're clearing it out so when Skynet goes online, John Connor will have somewhere to go and lead the rest of us to victory.
  • So, if I was a hostile nation that could sneak one suitcase bomb into the US, couldn't I just set it off near the AFB they're moving NORAD to before launching my missles?

    I'd kill all the NORAD personnel, and even if they were others it'd take them a few hours to get the mountain up and running. By then the missles will have already flown.

  • I'm so confused.... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by demachina (71715) on Sunday July 30 2006, @12:58PM (#15812131)
    My fearless leader.....Dick Cheney....keeps telling me how we are in imminent danger of some rogue state, North Korea, Iraq, Iran or terrorist group, lobbing a nuke at us. On the one hand we have the whole "mushroom cloud" syndrome, and now the Pentagon tells me our penultimate bunker isn't really needed any more to defend our command and control center from a "mushroom cloud". Cheyenne Mountain actually wasn't worth much during the cold war when our main adversary had multi megaton nukes. It actually might stand up to the kiloton class nukes rogue states and terrorist groups are most likely to get. So we move command and control to a place where it will be relatively easy to destroy and decapitate one of the most critical command and control centers we have. And we do it AFTER we spend $700 million in a failed attempt to upgrade the one we are closing down. You really have to wonder if the people in charge really are completely incompetent to manage their own affairs let alone those of a superpower.

      • Re:No reason to be confused (Score:5, Insightful)

        by demachina (71715) on Sunday July 30 2006, @02:12PM (#15812552)
        "Present threats - including those that you describe - do not have that capability."

        Actually Russia still has that capability, its somewhat smaller than it was but its still there. One wonders why people pretend its not still there when it is. Russia is making such a killing on their oil and gas reserves I imagine its unlikely they will bother with a nuclear war, but hey a coup and a wacko get the keys, or relations continue to sour, anything could happen.

        Relations with Russia are in fact not very good. The U.S. has been treating Russia like dirt since the U.S.S.R collapsed. Gary Kasparov, chess grand master and now Democracy advocates, makes the interesting observation that Putin may be cheering on the chaos in the Middle East because everything that inflates oil and gas prices is a windfall for Russia.

        All in all you have to wonder about the wisdom of replacing America's penultimate bunker and command and control facility with an extremely vulnerable office building that could easily be attacked with conventional weapons, a truck bomb or chemical or biological weapons. Cheyenne Mountain was, if nothing else, good for PR and intimidation value.

        One question would be where the ABM system is controlled from. If its NORAD, and your worried the ABM system might work, then you take out NORAD first and then open the door for the ICBM's from North Korea.

        All in all it just seems like a silly move to make especially after you've just sunk $700 million in to Cheyenne Mountain.

  • Why not rent it ? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by thrill12 (711899) on Sunday July 30 2006, @01:03PM (#15812161)
    I am sure some narcistic, evil doctor would be very interested in acquiring a cave of his own (raises pink) muhahaha !

    Or, on a more serious note, we could just make a nice secure colocation facility there, beats Sealand [wikipedia.org] or something like Virtu [virtu.nl] (and there are more [thebunker.net] like that)...

  • Yes. It's Certainly Closing ;) (Score:5, Funny)

    by jonathansizz (942588) on Sunday July 30 2006, @02:40PM (#15812703)
    Yep. No doubt about it; it's closing down alright *wink*

    It's now out of action - nothing going on in there anymore *smirk*

    Things sure will be different now that Cheyenne Mountain is ceasing all operations *nudge*

    • Re:Yes. It's Certainly Closing ;) (Score:5, Insightful)

      by ElephanTS (624421) on Sunday July 30 2006, @07:20PM (#15813982)
      that's funny but I think it's true. There can only really be 2 reasons this is happening (based on my knowledge of miltary planning ahem)

      1. As you said, it's a bluff

      2. They've got something much much better built now and are going to it.

      The administration is busy commissioning more nuke weapons and Russia is becoming more threatening by the day. WW3 is near to breaking out all over the ME. No way are the military winding anything down.

  • Interesting... why now? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by ursabear (818651) on Sunday July 30 2006, @03:49PM (#15813056) Homepage Journal
    #>mput *.moviehumor
    #>put "Shall... we... play... a... game...?"?
    #>y
    #>Sorry Dave, can't do that right now...

    But seriously... why would the government/military choose to put it on "warm standby" just now? Is it just budgetary?

    Sometimes shutting down stuff saves money, yes... but sometimes the costs aren't readable in print on a budget page...

  • OK, No Mention of the USS Wright??? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Wingsy (761354) on Sunday July 30 2006, @03:59PM (#15813107)
    There were two ships, the Northhampton and the Wright. One was always at sea while the other was in port. I was on the USS Wright for a couple of years and it was a pretty cool place to be if you had to be somewhere in the Navy. During our 2-week cruise we would sail to some vacation resort (St. Thomas, St. Croix, Nova Scotia, Bermuda, etc) and tie up for a week. That was our "cruise". See, it carried so many top brass that us peons had it pretty good too - THEY didn't want to paddle around for 2 weeks at a time, so we always put in at some really nice port along the eastern seaboard. Captain was even nice enough to let us bring our motorcycles along. Like at San Juan, we had to report in at 8AM for a roll call, then we got on our bikes and toured the island until the next morning. The ship though, was something else. It was a converted aircraft carrier with a humongous antenna farm on the flight deck. The entire rear section of the ship was a powerful VLF transmitter, with vacuum tubes taller than I am. Each stage of the transmitter was in its own compartment (like the "Pi Network Room" sign on the door). They had this helicopter with twin interlocking blades (no tail rotor) that hauled a cable to 10,000 feet for the VLF antenna - the most powerful VLF transmitter in the world at that time (talking about ERP). All the pilot did was take off and land, as it was flown from the ship most of the time it was airborne. Most of the ship was off limits to everyone I knew, and all I did was calibrate & repair electronic test equipment. Ever see the bow of a carrier underwater? Like they say, it's an adventure. :)

    • Re:OK, No Mention of the USS Wright??? (Score:4, Interesting)

      by payndz (589033) on Sunday July 30 2006, @04:36PM (#15813263)
      Wiki on the USS Wright [wikipedia.org]

      That's really cool - one of those things that you think are a bit Clancy-ish, and are then geeked out by when you find that they really existed (like the hover platforms from MGS3). The question is, of course: what replaced CC-2 and CLC-1? Any techno-thriller fan would demand some kind of super-secret nuclear-powered megaship constantly circling the globe without ever turning into port, with packs of bad guys just waiting for the ideal moment to strike and take it over...

    • Re:OT: Canadians? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by LWATCDR (28044) on Sunday July 30 2006, @01:11PM (#15812208) Homepage Journal
      Same reason the US military is in the UK. NORAD is like NATO. It s a multi-national organization. The US and Canada joined together to defend North American from attack from the USSR and China.
      I have run into flight crews from the UK, Australia, and Norway at US bases. There are many military personal from other countries including countries in Europe in the US all the time. UK subs pick up their Trident Missiles from a joint US UK stockpile at base in the US. They are then fitted with UK made warheads.
      You didn't really believe all that propaganda that military cooperation between the US in other countries was totally one sided did you?
       

      • Re:OT: Canadians? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by tootlemonde (579170) on Sunday July 30 2006, @05:44PM (#15813577)

        The US and Canada joined together to defend North American from attack from the USSR and China.

        On 9/11 all air traffic in the U.S. and Canada was grounded simultaneously. The next day the Prime Minister of Canada was asked by a reporter how soon flights in Canada would resume. He answered simply, "I don't know. The air space belongs to Norad."

        Under joint North American defense treaties [forces.gc.ca], Canadian military officers participated in the second Gulf War even though the same Prime Minister had explicitly refused to join the coalition. At the time, the U.S. ambassador to Canada observed that more Canadians participated in the war than 90% of the countries that formally supported it.

        There was even a treaty signed recently that allows U.S. and Canadian forces to cross into each other's countries without any formal invitation under certain emergency conditions.

        It appears that behind the public posturing about sovereignty and national identity, the defense of North America takes priority over everything. Some people will find that fact comforting and others find it alarming.

    • Re:OT: Canadians? (Score:4, Interesting)

      by theshowmecanuck (703852) on Sunday July 30 2006, @02:16PM (#15812579) Journal

      As stated: NORAD == *North American* Aerospace Defense [archives.cbc.ca]

      Canada was involved from the beginning. As a matter of fact there is a Canadian counterpart to Cheyenne Mountain [forces.gc.ca] near North Bay, Ontario. It is buried about 200 metres into the solid granite of the Canadian Shield [wikipedia.org] bedrock which makes up the geology of the area. There are American military personnel permanently working there, just as Canadian military work in Cheyenne Mountain.

      The likely attack of Soviet bombers or missiles is over the pole. This was especially true during the late 1950's (when NORAD was formed), and probably continued to be the direction of most threat during the cold war. So most of the radar stations watching for this are in Canada. The famous early version was the DEW line (Distant Early Warning) of radar stations.

      SCARY FACT!!!: Canada once had NUCLEAR TIPPED BOMARC ANTI-AIRCRAFT MISSILES to be used against Soviet bombers in the event of war. They were a purchased in part to move them further north (so that when they exploded after firing at Soviet bombers, it would be in the Arctic instead of say, over Winnipeg, Calgary or Edmonton if they were fired from the U.S.A.) and as an additional replacement for the ignorant John Diefenbaker's incompetent handling of Canada's defense when he canceled the Avro Arrow [www.exn.ca] (a very advanced intercepter fighter whose speed was projected to eventually top Mach 3 and had the first fly-by-wire avionics).

    • You're going to have to fight Dick Cheney for it. Word is that he's already moved his undisclosed location there, and he'll shoot any trespassers in the face.

    • Re:Doesn't surprise me at all... (Score:4, Informative)

      by kimvette (919543) on Sunday July 30 2006, @01:14PM (#15812229) Homepage
      http://maps.google.com/maps?q=cheyenne%20mountain& ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla :en-US:official&sa=N&tab=wl [google.com]

      Not a whole lot to see.

      (Please don't waste mod points modding this up informative, all I did was post a URL to google maps.)

    • Re:Doesn't surprise me at all... (Score:5, Informative)

      by Jerry Coffin (824726) on Sunday July 30 2006, @01:26PM (#15812300)
      They probably have another "secret" base to do this work from.

      You seem to be talking about Schriever Air Force Base [af.mil]. Interestingly, this is also pretty close by. According to TFA, one of the reasons for the move is the commute between Peterson and Cheyenne Mountain. From Peterson to Cheyenne Mountain [mapquest.com] is a fairly ugly drive directly through Colorado Springs (the end of that route isn't quite right, but Mapquest doesn't seem to know exactly where the entrance to NORAD is. By contrast, from Peterson to Schriever [mapquest.com] is almost entirely through open country with minimal traffic.

      You can probably find some good satellite photos on Google.

      You hardly need satellite photos. I'd guess some people living near the Broadmoor can probably see traffic in and out of the mountain with nothing more than binoculars or maybe a small telescope at most. OTOH, there's not really much to see -- almost everything is underground, and about all you can see from the outside is the entrance to a tunnel into the mountain. About all you'd see from a satellite photo would be a road that disappears into the side of a mountain with a LOT of antennas on top (though a lot of them belong to the local radio stations, TV stations, Sprint Broadband, etc.)

          • It seems the Goa'uld are big on apostrophes.

            And darn near every other alien race in sci-fi (and fantasy). Nothing says alien like an apostrophe... Perhaps because most Americans' are so unfamiliar with them.

          • Re:Oblig SG-1 (Score:5, Funny)

            by Fear the Clam (230933) on Sunday July 30 2006, @04:22PM (#15813194)
            It seems the Goa'uld are big on apostrophes

            Those people who stick an apostrophe on every word that ends with "s" are probably Goa'uld sympathizers. Better kill them just be sure.

      • You'd probably be fired if you suggested something like that. And for good reason.

        Websites aren't nearly important enough to warrant the huge expense of operating in an underground mountain bunker. What's the point? If there were a nuclear war or some other gigantic disaster, there would be so many other outages and problems, not being able to access a website would be the last of people's concerns. That's assuming there'd even be electricity and computers left to access the web. And you'd save so

    • Re:So much protection... (Score:4, Interesting)

      by ScrewMaster (602015) on Sunday July 30 2006, @04:11PM (#15813157)
      because if there ever is a major thermonuclear conflict you need to have a functioning chain-of-command, so that there will be someone capable of saying "stop". Matter of fact, in an all-out war between two or more nuclear superpowers the last thing you want to do is knock of the enemy's leadership early in the game: if they have no way of surrendering (meaning: ordering their missile commanders to stand down) things can go from terrible to terminal.

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